Retiring From Military Soon

[CJMeredith]

I've been reading through a lot of the threads on this site for a couple of weeks now and thought I'd post as well. I'm a 40 year old Army officer (Infantry background - not aviation. Currently working as an Intelligence Officer) and have about 18 1/2 years in service right now. I have my ASEL with about 100 hours and am seriously considering getting out at the 20 year mark and taking a shot at a flying career. I could be out on terminal leave as early as April of next year. I'd either finish out my certifications between now and then at FBOs or go to a flight academy after I was out.

I have a wife and two kids (9 and 12), so I need to be careful not to do anything TOO stupid. Nevertheless, financially it seems doable. My wife is finishing up her master's now and will be working by next year. Between her income and my retirement, even first year FO wages will allow us to maintain our current QOL (and the kids don't REALLY need to go to college ). It's really the opportunity costs of pursuing a flying career that make this a tough decision. I could do pretty well as a government contractor and make enough money to do as much flying as I had time for as a hobby. I don't love what I currently do (and would continue to do as a contractor), but it's okay - It's good, meaningful work. I almost WISH I hated my job - that would make this easier. The problem is that I really want to fly, but it will take me several years of flying (under ideal conditions) to make as much as I would otherwise. Ultimately, it can't be all about money, but I can't completely discount it either.

My brother (also a GA pilot) recently retired from the Navy and went through a similar decision making process. There were many reasons why he decided against aviation, but the biggest one was that he didn't want to take a chance of making a big mistake. As he puts it, what I'm considering is a high risk venture (even with my retirement as a safety net). That being said, I suspect that if he had it to do over again, he'd consider it a little harder.

My wife is generally supportive of the idea if I decide to pursue it, but I know it makes her nervous. She's been looking forward to getting out of the Army and having a relatively normal life. But, I can't honestly say that I'm looking forward to the kind of future I've got myself lined up for. The money would be nice, but I just don't have a driving passion for my job. Ever since I started thinking about walking away and pursuing aviation full time, I've felt really excited about my future again (a feeling I've not felt for a few years). Still, how am I going to feel in five years if I'm furloughed or I've lost my medical?

I know there are a lot of guys on this board that have made the leap into this world older and with far less safety net than I have. I really applaud your passion and courage. Reading about others who have made the transition is what is adding fuel to my fire. It sounds like it really can be done. I am curious though if any of you older guys out there who transitioned regret your decision to pursue a career in aviation. How about QOL? My family is used to deployments, so a few days a week isn't really a big deal, but that doesn't make it pleasant. Finally, it's hard to get a really good consolidated overview of what this career field looks like by cruising around pilot forums. I know there are plenty of articles and books out there, but are there any that some of you would recommend as being particularly good?

I'm really glad I found this forum. It's been a great source of information!

[LAFF]

I'm in the same boat and also in the DC area. You can PM me if you want and we can talk about things off-line (privacy).

I'm going to do it but its a big step down (pay / benefits) - my skill set and security clearances can land me a very nice corporate job.



-LAFF

USAF

[jet-dreams]

CJMeredith,

I am close to your age and considering a career change as well. I have been looking for the perfect answer to your question for a long time now. Well guess what there isn’t one there is no magic 8 ball. I think only you can answer the question for yourself.

Let’s pretend for a minute you chose to stay in your current line of work, it’s 10 years from now and your making great money but still feel a sense of something lacking. Is this what you want to happen because it will if you truly love to FLY.
I say this because I made the same decision 10 years ago. I choose to stay at my current job instead of pursuing a career as a pilot. Well guess what? I am still asking what if?

Okay now that I have tried to encourage you I guess it’s my time to get out and start working on my instrument rating so I can make the career change. I don’t want to have the “what ifs” for the rest of my life.

[CJMeredith]

Erick...You just voiced my greatest fear! I don't want to be an old man wondering "what if." That's the best reason I can think of for just going for it and why I'm strongly inclined to do this.

[GalaxyIFE]

CJ,

Not really advice here, but just my .02 worth. We obviously do not know your current financial situation or how much time you can put towards training before retirement. If you are able to continue training at a reasonable pace (given money and time availability) at an FBO I would certainly do that. If you have the GI Bill, it's even better...less money out of your pocket. I love my job (fly about 30% of the time and in the office the rest) but the office part I hate. I have no qualms taking the risk when I retire from AD, but I am not married and don't have kids. I think if I was "on the fence" about my job (one that I could continue to do after AD retirement) I would probably stick it out and perhaps CFI on the side. Then I would have comparisons to make. I do think you need to understand that almost ANY commercial flying you do will require you to move, and perhaps several times over...sure if you are an airline guy you could commute, but I think almost 90% of folks will say that sucks!!! Also I think it is an absolute requirement that your wife is behind you 110%, if she isn't, there WILL be issues. Aviation is a terrible thing, worse than any drug I know of...

As far as good books, not sure except "Flying the Line I and II" (by ALPA) but I am not sure that will help answer your questions. There is SOOOOO much information on line (here and other sites) that really show how fluid things are in this industry. Some of the Blogs are really good too, some have daily (or nearly daily) updates about training, flying the line, instructing and such. So, I would sift through what is out there, and avoid the threads that are more than 3 pages long...cause that is just a bunch of people arguing about something . Good luck and keep us up to date on what's going on!!!

[skydog]

There are always going to be "what ifs" in life, not matter what decision you make. "What if" you make the change to aviation and then lose your medical in 5 years? Will you spend the rest of your career wondering "what" your life would be like "if" you had chosen to pursue something other than aviation?

That said, if I were you I would stay away from aviation, and here's why: You don't sound as though you are fully committed to it. Aviation is a pursuit that is not for the faint of heart. If you are not prepared to give it 100% and persevere regardless of the obstacles, then you ought to consider another line of work. Consider that you even if you give it everything you have, you could still wind up spending your career job hopping at third-rate operators. I've known plenty of well-qualified pilots who spent their entire careers doing that because they were never in the right place at the right time.

Now consider your age. I'm guessing you are 40+. Figure two years until you are minimally qualified to instruct. Another year or two before you are qualified to fly for a commuter. 5 years there and then on the majors (assuming any are left). Now you're in the right seat with 10 year + upgrade. You might make Captain by the time you are 60, you might not. That's assuming you don't medically dequal before that (I've read that less than half of pilots made it the old mandatory retirement age of 60).

Now consider your family. For the past two decades they have lived with all that goes with a military life, and have probably done so uncomplainingly. Although they may not have said so, I am guessing that they are looking forward to having you home. To retire from the military life and go in the airline life...well you might as well stay for another 10 and get a full retirement.

I don't know what kind of opportunities there are for a retired military intelligence officers, but I imagine that there are some, and they are probably more lucrative than anything airlines or aviation can offer, at least within the time frame you have to work with. If you "just wanna fly" then I reccomend getting your ratings through instructor, and doing that in your free time.

Heck, you could even stay in for another 10, work on your ratings and build some hours along the way, collect that full retirement, and still have another 10+ years to enjoy an airline career. Believe me, 10 years is enough.

To sum it all up: Given where you are in life; family, financially, and career wise, to me the numbers just don't add up to pursuing an aviation career. If your demographics were different I might advise otherwise.

One other thing: So many people show interest in changing careers (to aviation or otherwise) because they are not happy with work. Maybe I am in the minority here, but to me, the purpose of working is so that you are better able to enjoy your time away from work.
If you enjoy what you do, but are never home because of work, then what's the point? That's the reason I left the airlines after 10+ years.

There you have it: my advice. Worth every penny you paid for it.

[Velocipede]

Just don't make the mistake of going to a non-Union airline that undercuts Union contracts.

[CJMeredith]

Thanks for the responses. I spent some time last night finding some good blog sites and there really is some great information on those. The sub-cultures that exist on the internet never cease to amaze me. Just 10 years ago you'd have to know a regional pilot personally to get just a tiny fraction of the information available to anybody who takes time to search for it on the internet today.

Skydog, it's a fair statement to say that I'm not fully committed to the idea of pursuing an aviation career, but I don't think I know enough yet to fully commit. This is still just a concept that I'm trying to flesh out and build into a workable plan. I've got some time before I have to decide and it would be foolish if I didn't at least consider all of the angles. You raised some very valid considerations though. I thought your point that your job is what you do to enjoy the rest of your life was particularly good. I think men, in particular, put so much of themselves into their jobs and expect passion. I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing, but I'm certainly one of those - if I don't feel passionately about my job anymore then I feel like something is wrong. Yours is probably the healthier view.

I have decided to get to work on my instrument rating as a first step. That's something I would have done eventually anyway. I've just been funneling my money into building an experimental lately (Vans RV-7). I just need to slow down on that and do more flying! In the meantime, I'll keep reading and researching.

[3green]

I was reading this thread and as someone who made the leap from one career to an airline pilot I can tell you its alot harder than all the snazzy advertisements say. The last couple of months I've spent a total of 2 weeks at home(and that was alot of 1 day home visits before jumpseating back to work). Nothing is as fun as getting paid meager wages for a more than full time job. And the worst part for me is standing around the terminal waiting for the shuttle at night freezing my y'know what off or trying to catch a ride home on a fullflight...

Honestly, the easy part was getting the ratings. I used to ask myself "what if?" quite a bit. But, I now have the question in my head "how nice" it would be at home(everyday), being with my family(everyday) and making a liveable wage. In the end I made a decision and have to live with it. I still love aviation and am optimistic things will get better once I'm based at home. But, sitting in the hotel away from home reminds you daily what you give up for the "dream".

Its nice to see everyone posting all the factors that you need to take into account for before taking the leap.

[Ian J]

CJ - welcome to JC.

What you need to do is MDMP this thing out. Focus heavily on COA analysis.

Seriously though, I'm a former Army Officer myself, who forwent a retirement and REFRADed to pursue civil aviation. I thoroughly enjoy it and am happy with my decision. Yes, the pay sucks at first, but with the lower pay comes an exceptionally reduced amount of responsibility and BS.

Good luck,

Ian

[CJMeredith]

Originally Posted by Ian J

What you need to do is MDMP this thing out. Focus heavily on COA analysis.

Ha! Now you're speaking my language! I'm almost ashamed to admit that I really have been building a course of action analysis chart, listing my evaluation criteria and determining how to weight it When I get around to wargaming, my wife will make a great S-2 as she shoots holes in all of my plans I'm not sure if I'm really lame or just putting some of this Army training to good use.

Chris

[Ian J]

Originally Posted by CJMeredith

Ha! Now you're speaking my language! I'm almost ashamed to admit that I really have been building a course of action analysis chart, listing my evaluation criteria and determining how to weight it When I get around to wargaming, my wife will make a great S-2 as she shoots holes in all of my plans I'm not sure if I'm really lame or just putting some of this Army training to good use.

Chris

I've done it too.

[jet-dreams]

3Green- Would you make the same career change again if you could do it all over?

CJMeredith- Me and you have much in common when it comes to our aviation life. I am also building an experimental airplane. A Cozy MKIV as seen in my avatar.

[CJMeredith]

Originally Posted by jet-dreams

CJMeredith- Me and you have much in common when it comes to our aviation life. I am also building an experimental airplane. A Cozy MKIV as seen in my avatar.

Very cool Erick. I like the Cozy. I seriously considered it (and some of the other canards) because it was an affordable 4 place with good builder support. But, honestly the mission profile that I decided upon included light aerobatics and short field capability. But you can't beat the Cozy for cross country and speed. Sadly, if I pursue aviation as a career, I may have to give up the RV - I could pay for a complete flight training academy for what I have left to spend on it (fuselage, engine and avionics). I'd probably store it in my brother's hangar until I could afford to come back to it - I'll never have the heart to sell it. In fact, I need to pound some rivets this weekend (not that you'd know anything about that!)

Chris