Need info for CFI training.

[slushie]

I have some money available from mom once I get a plan (as well as the rest of the money) together.

What is it going to take to get me through the CFI checkride with a "Damn, Mark, that was the best checkride I've ever given!" at the end?
Not dollars...ground and flight hours.

Commercial Single, IR
330 total
Lots of XC
A good deal of right seat experience
Not current IFR for a LONG time.
Last 9 months of flying has been quite casual.

Help me out bruddas!

[mojo6911]

Go with the part 141 minimums. After 40 hours of ground school and 25 hours of flight time, you should be more than good enough to pass the checkride. YMMV

[jrh]

Originally Posted by mojo6911

After 40 hours of ground school and 25 hours of flight time, you should be more than good enough to pass the checkride. YMMV

If anything, you might be able to do it in a little less than 25 flight hours...18-20 hours maybe. Same with ground...if you study hard, I think in the neighborhood of 25-30 ground hours is doable.

Honestly, there are a lot of 3, 5, or 7 day accelerated CFI courses out there that would get the job done. I'm not sure how good the quality of their training is, but they get you the ticket at least.

Even if you don't do an accelerated course, you could still hammer things out in 2 or 3 weeks of serious training at your local airport.

Also, don't worry about being instrument proficient...the CFI ride is 100% VFR.

Good luck with everything!

[slushie]

Seriously, thanks a bunch, guys. I already know where and with who I'm going to do the training.
I'm just going over their advertised numbers again(all they show CFI for is 61), ...it looks like this:

10 Hours Flight Time - Piper Arrow
5 Hours of Flight Time - Cessna 172
15 Hours Flight Instruction
25 Hours of Ground

15 hours of flying seemed a little low to me, and that's why I asked.

[mojo6911]

I did my CFI in 3 hours ground and 4 hours flight time. I put in a lot of work on my own. The PTS is there, so develop your lesson plans around that. Everyone does it at a different pace.

[jrh]

Originally Posted by slushie

10 Hours Flight Time - Piper Arrow
5 Hours of Flight Time - Cessna 172
15 Hours Flight Instruction
25 Hours of Ground

15 hours of flying seemed a little low to me, and that's why I asked.

I dunno...that doesn't seem terribly far out of line. I think the biggest factors for the flying will be how proficient you are in the Arrow and how naturally good you are at talking/explaining things while you fly.

Those published numbers are probably on the low end of average, but if you work hard, completely possible.

Do you still own that 152? You might be able to save some money by getting an instructor to fly with you in your own plane to get you talking/explaining maneuvers while you fly, then transitioning into the Arrow and spending less time in the Arrow. That's what those 5 hours of 172 time are listed for. Something to think about.

[MichaelCPS]

Originally Posted by slushie

Seriously, thanks a bunch, guys. I already know where and with who I'm going to do the training.
I'm just going over their advertised numbers again(all they show CFI for is 61), ...it looks like this:

10 Hours Flight Time - Piper Arrow
5 Hours of Flight Time - Cessna 172
15 Hours Flight Instruction
25 Hours of Ground

15 hours of flying seemed a little low to me, and that's why I asked.

Remember, the CFI is a teaching certificate. You have already proven that you can fly to Commercial Pilot Standards. Now you have to just continue at those standards in the right seat while teaching. I have found that when working with CFI candidates, the flying is the easy part. It is the talking and classroom teaching which they struggle to pull together. 25 hours of ground really isn't that much. I would expect you to have ALOT of self-study to supplement.

Michael

[slushie]

I can do self-study for sure :P
I want to do it this summer when I have one or no classes at school.
So, just to be safe, should I budget for 20 flight/30 ground?

[desertdog71]

Originally Posted by slushie

I can do self-study for sure :P
I want to do it this summer when I have one or no classes at school.
So, just to be safe, should I budget for 20 flight/30 ground?

WTH???!!!!

Its not that difficult. Study the PTS, Highlight and Tab your FAR/AIM, Study the FOI. After that its just a matter of doing the maneuvers from the right seat and talking through them. I don't think you need that much time at all. You are a commercial pilot now, you should be plenty knowledgeable about the basics, just bring it all together. Solo in the plane and get the maneuvers down, thats about it.

I am sure others will disagree, but this is my opinion. Don't overthink it.

[slushie]

Originally Posted by desertdog71

WTH???!!!!

Its not that difficult.

Says the man who went about flight training the hardcore way!!!



All I know is I've been in the almost-done-but-no-more-money situation before. Just doing some research, Mr. W.

[MichaelCPS]

Originally Posted by slushie

I can do self-study for sure :P
I want to do it this summer when I have one or no classes at school.
So, just to be safe, should I budget for 20 flight/30 ground?

I think that is a safe assessment. My program provides about 50-60 hours of ground and 25 hours of flight (including the checkride). The flight time is more than enough. Sometimes there just isn't enough ground time, even at 50-60 hours. If you know your stuff going in, 20-30 ground should be plenty. If you need to be spoon fed, you are looking at 50-60. There is just so much information to soak up, and then you need to learn to teach all of that info.

Michael

[FlyinTim]

Self study is key for the CFI. For every hour flying/ground with your cfi you should put in 4 hours of self study to be cost effective. I taught a CFI canidate once who went out and bought his own whiteboard, and taught his wife/cat everything.. before he taught it to me. I can't say how well this helped him. Your own personal research, with a lot of time reviewing the PTS (the feds basically give you the entire test..) should be most of your CFI work.

-Tim

[FlyinTim]

also..the ASA CFI Oral Exam guide is realllyyy handy.. and going to your cfi ride with everything tagged (endorsements and such) makes you look sharp. You pass the checkride in the first 15 minutes unless you do something realllyy stupid.

[wrxpilot]

Originally Posted by FlyinTim

Self study is key for the CFI. For every hour flying/ground with your cfi you should put in 4 hours of self study to be cost effective.

What is it that most people study for the CFI? I studied my tail off for the commercial oral, and am very current with airspace, systems, part 91/61, equipment requirements, part 23, weather, navigation, physiological factors, etc. My commercial DE has a rep for nailing applicants during the oral, so I spent A LOT of time studying. I did my IA in December, so I'm still fresh on instrument knowledge.

Now that I'm getting ready for the CFI stuff (currently taking the CFII, FOI, and CFI writtens over the next several weeks - starting with CFII tomorrow), I'm not really sure what to study for the CFI practical tests - other than developing lesson plans.

Do you have to have Part 61 memorized? Have pilot signoffs memorized?

I won't be training extensively with my CFI for a few weeks, but I want to get a jump on things.

[jrh]

Originally Posted by wrxpilot

What is it that most people study for the CFI?

...

I'm not really sure what to study for the CFI practical tests - other than developing lesson plans.

Do you have to have Part 61 memorized? Have pilot signoffs memorized?

Aerodynamics is a big area to study.

Also, teaching somebody, such as what you'll be doing during a CFI oral, is a lot more difficult than just spitting out an answer, which is what was required during your previous orals. How are you going to explain to somebody how to fly straight and level on their first flight? Why does the plane naturally weathervane into the wind just after liftoff during a crosswind takeoff? It's those kinds of questions that most people don't think about until their CFI training, but is important to be able to explain to a brand new student.

Another thing to start thinking about is the building block concept--what does a person need to know before learning a new skill? For instance, what skills do they need to understand before doing slow flight? They'll do best if they already understand the left turning tendencies, how to use reference points outside the aircraft, how to use trim, the drag curve (induced vs. parasite drag), how there is a horizontal and vertical component of lift, etc. Basically, there's a lot more to it than just reducing the power and raising the nose. It will take you time to break down each task into the most basic elements needed to learn it.

As for memorizing Part 61 or signoffs--generally speaking, you shouldn't have to memorize much, if any, for your CFI ride. But you should know what's in there and be able to look up answers quickly.

[wrxpilot]

Originally Posted by jrh

Also, teaching somebody, such as what you'll be doing during a CFI oral, is a lot more difficult than just spitting out an answer, which is what was required during your previous orals.

Thanks JRH. So I guess as with most things, you really can't teach a subject until you know it cold. This makes sense, because if one has a weak understanding of a maneuver for example, they will be unable to disect it and/or explain alternative ways of accomplishing it.

So with the CFI, it seems a lot of the studying is spent on "how do I explain this in a simple way?". I guess it's time I start teaching my brother (roommate) how to fly - whether he wants to or not, lol. Thanks again!