logging CFII time

[BuickCFI]

i know i can't log instrument unless i fly the approach or we are in actual. I am wondering about logging route of flight. if we don't do a landing at one of the airports we use for an approach, how do i log that.

example, GFK-RDR-GFK. RDR is an AFB so we can't land there anyway. i was not flying the approach, but i was instructing, how do i log this? the student can log it for sure i assume, but what about me?

[dc3flyer]

Just log it like any other flight. If you land (or your student lands) at an airport, write it down. You can write it the approaches yours student did, but you can't actually log an approach unless you are IFR. You also cannot log it as cross country unless you (or your student) lands at another airport.

[BuickCFI]

Originally Posted by dc3flyer

Just log it like any other flight. If you land (or your student lands) at an airport, write it down. You can write it the approaches yours student did, but you can't actually log an approach unless you are IFR. You also cannot log it as cross country unless you (or your student) lands at another airport.

ok, so with just the approach it would just be a "local flight", ie GFK-GFK

[Snickersnwa]

Originally Posted by BuickCFI

ok, so with just the approach it would just be a "local flight", ie GFK-GFK

That's been the way I've been loggin 'em

[MidlifeFlyer]

Originally Posted by BuickCFI

example, GFK-RDR-GFK. RDR is an AFB so we can't land there anyway. i was not flying the approach, but i was instructing, how do i log this? the student can log it for sure i assume, but what about me?

For you it's PIC and total flight time and, of course, dual given if you keep track of that. You don't get to log the approach or any instrument time since the student was wearing the hood, not you, and you weren't in actual.

But that's so basic, I'm sure your question has to have more to it.

[BuickCFI]

Originally Posted by MidlifeFlyer

For you it's PIC and total flight time and, of course, dual given if you keep track of that. You don't get to log the approach or any instrument time since the student was wearing the hood, not you, and you weren't in actual.

But that's so basic, I'm sure your question has to have more to it.

actually no, that was it. i was just unfamiliar with how to log it with no landings. ie even if I took the plane and did an approach at a different airport but low approach only it would just be a local flight, that is all i was unsure on. i couldn't remember nor could i find anything in the regs to answer my question.

[dbakeg00]

Originally Posted by MidlifeFlyer

For you it's PIC and total flight time and, of course, dual given if you keep track of that. You don't get to log the approach or any instrument time since the student was wearing the hood, not you, and you weren't in actual.

But that's so basic, I'm sure your question has to have more to it.

Im not saying that he can log inst. time, but just a point...the regs say nothing about a "hood." Instrument time is defined as flight with reference soley to the instruments. Correct me if I'm wrong, but cant a person log inst time without wearing a hood. You know, on the honor system?

[ananoman]

Originally Posted by dc3flyer

Just log it like any other flight. If you land (or your student lands) at an airport, write it down. You can write it the approaches yours student did, but you can't actually log an approach unless you are IFR. You also cannot log it as cross country unless you (or your student) lands at another airport.

Once you have your commercial, which is mandatory for your CFI, you don't actually have to land to log cross country time for your ATP. All you have to do is go 50 miles from where you started and then find your way back. So, if you go more than 50 miles from home, log it as CC time in your log book.

If you need CC time for some other purpose, like 135 minimums, just let your student land every now and then. You can even ask for the option and then go missed if you have too.

[ananoman]

Originally Posted by BuickCFI

actually no, that was it. i was just unfamiliar with how to log it with no landings. ie even if I took the plane and did an approach at a different airport but low approach only it would just be a local flight, that is all i was unsure on. i couldn't remember nor could i find anything in the regs to answer my question.

I still wrote in all the airports I went too. It is easier to keep track of what you did. Just because you write airports down in the beginning of your entry, doesn't necessarily mean you have to land there. You have a separate line for landings and CC time anyway.

[MidlifeFlyer]

Originally Posted by dbakeg00

Im not saying that he can log inst. time, but just a point...the regs say nothing about a "hood." Instrument time is defined as flight with reference solely to the instruments. Correct me if I'm wrong, but cant a person log inst time without wearing a hood. You know, on the honor system?

Well, you certainly can log actual instrument time without a hood.

As to simulated time, I've heard some people claim that a pilot can log simulated instrument time by just averting their eyes. But every single FAA reference on the subject I've ever seen, from FAA Legal's definition of simulated instrument time

==============================
"Simulated" instrument conditions occur when the pilot's vision outside of the aircraft is intentionally restricted, such as by a hood or goggles.
==============================
(other than the examples, not the use or "restricted" not "averted."

to FAR 61.45(d) which describes the required simulated instrument flight equipment for a flight test to be:
==============================
A device that prevents the applicant from having visual reference outside the aircraft ...
==============================

strongly suggests to me anyway that for there to be simulated instrument flight, the FAA is looking for a device of some kind that prevents the pilot from looking and that "Hee, hee, I didn't really look" doesn't quite cut it, even with the required safety pilot.

[nosehair]

Originally Posted by dbakeg00

You know, on the honor system?

Ditto. You cannot help but subconsciously "detect", from your peripheral vision, outside cues if you have a window in your field of vision out the side or in front. You know the expression, "One peek is worth a thousand cross-checks." When you get the "leans", it only takes one quick peek to see the real world, and all that out-of-kilter feeling goes away. But you are cheating yourself and setting yourself up for real disaster.

There is no honor in what you are suggesting.

[BuickCFI]

i think i will just log them as local flights. this airport is only like 8nm way, 12 at the most