Becoming a CFI

[kevin7720]

Hello, I have never posted before but have been reading the forum off and on for years. I have some questions for current CFI's out there. Just a little information about myself. I currently have no future ambition for flying professionally but I do have an ambition for becoming an instructor. I'm currently a firefighter and have been in the same profession for 12 years. I am very happy with the profession but I would like to find a way to build time and experience without the financial burden of paying for all of my flight time.

I would be able to invest alot of time instructing since my schedule usually has me working 2 days a week for 24 hours. My schedule is actually very flexible and I could make last minute changes to my schedule probably 50% of the time.

My questions are:

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport? Keep in mind that I would try to limit sitting at the airport behind a desk waiting for someone to walk in to a minimum.

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

5. I am in the seattle area and I am not sure what CFI wages are for my area. I do know what the going rate is for instruction but don't know how much of it makes it to the instructor.

Thanks for you input and I may have more questions in the future and if I need to elaborate on the responses.

[Timbuff10]

Originally Posted by kevin7720

I currently have no future ambition for flying professionally but I do have an ambition for becoming an instructor.

I think I know what you mean but that kind of mentality contributes to lower pay. Being a CFI should be viewed as flying professionally. Perhaps you mean you have no desire to be an airline pilot?

Originally Posted by kevin7720

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

I have no doubt more people would be CFIs longer if it paid more. I would love to be a longtime CFI if I knew I was going to make a good wage, had a consistant schedule and a good quality of life. Those things unfortunately don't usually come with the CFI job though.

Originally Posted by kevin7720

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

I had a flight this morning with a guy who had not flown in a long time... He did great, I taught him a few things (I hope) and he said he had a blast! I love the feeling of sitting by the runway and watching my student fly the plane by himself when a month ago he didnt know what the yoke was for. Very rewarding for sure!

Originally Posted by kevin7720

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport? Keep in mind that I would try to limit sitting at the airport behind a desk waiting for someone to walk in to a minimum.

I am a flight instructor, not a office clerk, I say shame on the flight schools that require their CFIs to stand around (cleaning/doing office work) waiting for students to walk in the door. That is unless the CFI keeps the entire fee that the student is charged. I do love going into the airport though, especially when the weather is nice and I know the student has a good chance to put it all together without outside variables.

Originally Posted by kevin7720

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

I like working at the FBO type of place as it lets you focus on one thing (that being instructing) Being your own boss is fun too as you get all the profits but a lot of headache would come with that too. Plus if the business goes flat, you can lose big. Big risk=big reward/loss

Originally Posted by kevin7720

5. I am in the seattle area and I am not sure what CFI wages are for my area. I do know what the going rate is for instruction but don't know how much of it makes it to the instructor.

Probably not more than half... I have no clue on this one though.

[MidlifeFlyer]

Originally Posted by kevin7720

I currently have no future ambition for flying professionally but I do have an ambition for becoming an instructor. I'm currently a firefighter and have been in the same profession for 12 years. I am very happy with the profession but I would like to find a way to build time and experience without the financial burden of paying for all of my flight time.

As one part-time CFI to another potential one, good for you, especially if your desire to teach is motivated more by a pure desire to teach and for the personal experience and proficiency benefit it might bring to you (there is always a selfish component - that's not necessarily bad).

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

Sure. That's why there are other-career people and retirees who teach flying. There are easier ways to make a few bucks. But some people just "have to" teach.

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

It is, but that's a very personal thing. I have no need to build time. Instead I find teaching incredibility rewarding, something that I've always naturally gravitated to, and not just in aviation. So teaching actually meets some weird need that I have. besides, I've never been anything other than a "weekend warrior." Helping others learn and build their skills has made me a much better pilot than I would be otherwise.

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport? Keep in mind that I would try to limit sitting at the airport behind a desk waiting for someone to walk in to a minimum.

You bet If you're not worried about the pay, you have some leeway that those who need it to eat don't have.

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

FBOs are different. Where I teach, the CFIs are more or less independent. We have guidelines and rules and policies but we charge pretty much what we want and keep just about all of it. That varies, but it makes the difference between running my own show and working =with= an FBO inconsequential (BTW, I only take students referred to me by an FBO on very rare occasions - like a checkout or FR when there's no one else around. - I bring my own students to the organization. I don't want to take anything away from the CFIs who are working their way into a career).

[moxiepilot]

Originally Posted by kevin7720

My questions are:

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

It's not easy, let me tell you that - but we do get by....on RAMEN. The good paying gigs are hard to come by, but keepers. I probably make double in wages what most CFI's make.

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

YES! It is really rewarding. Just about every other day one of my students does something that makes me really proud or smile because of their performance. It comes to those unassisted landings, ability to explain something to me, or a "you've become a damn good pilot" days that make it worth all the time and effort.

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport? Keep in mind that I would try to limit sitting at the airport behind a desk waiting for someone to walk in to a minimum.

some days are hard to look forward to when flying with a student who comes unprepared all the time, whines about things all the time, or what I think of as problem students. Those students aren't the norm though. I try to give and give and give until I have nothing left before I will give up on a student. And that giving up comes down to the "why don't you try flying with X," talk.

I don't spend any time at the airport that I'm not flying. Mind you I put in 14 hour days, but it's all booked. Luckily my boss does great advertizing so there are walkins every day.

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

i don't mind it because I don't have to do any of my own advertizing which saves me a heck of a lot of time (I've had to do that before at the last job and it sucks).

I AM MY OWN BOSS. I dictate when I come and go, what hours I work and when I don't. My boss doesn't tell me that.


Good luck. I miss seattle

[gtpilot]

Originally Posted by kevin7720

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

This would be and may in the long run be my career. You have to be a bit more specalized to make a good living as an instructor, I think.

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

For many, myself especially, this is a very rewarding profession. Unfortunately, being a CFI is one of the few flying jobs one can get at with low hours. I can teach a man how to fly with 300hrs of experience but I can't get hired to fly a box around without more than 1200 hrs.

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport? Keep in mind that I would try to limit sitting at the airport behind a desk waiting for someone to walk in to a minimum.

I love 'working'! I even just sit around a lot because I like the environment. You just have to find the right school/fbo.

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

I would prefer to be independent but no one in our area rents airplanes to fully independent CFIs. My school is one of the few that even allows outside contracts with other students.

5. I am in the seattle area and I am not sure what CFI wages are for my area. I do know what the going rate is for instruction but don't know how much of it makes it to the instructor.

I get $20/hr from the school and charge $35 independently. I wouldn't take less than $20 from anyone personally.

You've got a good thing going with your primary job so this could be a great thing for you!

[jrh]

Originally Posted by kevin7720

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

Yes.

Originally Posted by kevin7720

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

It's been very rewarding for me. That being said, I would like to move up a bit within the ranks of being a CFI. I've reached a point where teaching in C-152s is still a lot of fun, but I'd like to try teaching at a bigger, faster level...maybe as an MEI, or freelancing in more exotic owner aircraft (Bonanzas, Cirruses, Saratogas, etc.). So it would be fun to "move on" yet still keep teaching.

Originally Posted by kevin7720

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport?

Yes. Like any job, I have days when I'd rather stay home, but as a whole, I'm happier going to work as a CFI than anything I've done before. I've worked as a computer tech, corn detasseler, warehouse general laborer, janitor, assembly line worker, teacher's assistant, and several other jobs before becoming a CFI--none of them were as fun to go in to.

Originally Posted by kevin7720

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

Working as an employee of my college's flight program has worked great for me. It's about the same as working for a good FBO. I have a steady stream of students with little to no work for advertising on my part. However, if I wanted to be a long-term CFI, I'd start at an FBO, get experience and a good reputation, then try to shift all of my flying over to freelance instructing. Freelance instructing generally means better pay and more flexibility.

[moxiepilot]

corn detassler jrh?

ha ha ha ha ha. i thought I had some pretty wierd jobs.

[jrh]

Originally Posted by moxiepilot

corn detassler jrh?

ha ha ha ha ha. i thought I had some pretty wierd jobs.

LOL. You've never spent much time around Iowa then, huh? Corn detasseling is a big summer job for a lot of teenagers in the midwest.

The job sucks. Probably one of the few jobs you couldn't pay me enough to do again. It includes getting bused with about 50 other workers for an hour's drive into the middle of nowhere, hiking up and down 3/4 mile long rows of corn, pulling out the tassels as fast as you can, all in 100+ degree humid weather. The corn fields create their own microclimate. You leave for work at about 6 or 7 in the morning and get done about 6 or 7 in the evening. You work rain or shine. The only times they'd clear us out of the field was for strong thunderstorms. So if it started raining, have fun hiking through the mud...

Funny thing is, at the time, it didn't seem that bad. Never again though...

[kevin7720]

Thanks for all of the responses to my questions about becoming a CFI. I am finishing up my private pilots license and will be starting my instrument rating this fall. I am very pleased to hear that there are instructors out there that enjoy the profession and feel that its a rewarding experience.

When I started flying in college I was in a flight program and I had to make the decision to take a break and work a while to pay for aviation costs. I ended up getting into the fire department to pay for flying and ended up enjoying the profession. Well 12 years later I have been looking up to the skies dreaming about flying again. It doesn't help that I work next to an airport that is one of the busiest general aviation airports in Washington.

Well if anybody else has some input please comment! I think one of my goals when I get closer to checking out of the fire department is to fly for a charter seaplane operation in Seattle. Now I think that becoming a CFI would fulfill my ambition and dreams in aviation.

Thanks again!!!

[DE727UPS]

Where have you been training and flying out of?

Your schedule is ideal for free lance instructing. You'd have more control and make more money if you bought a little plane to instruct in. I've known a few CFI's over the years that have done this out of BFI and RNT and moved on to the airlines. I did it myself out of TIW in the early 80's and at various time throughout my flying career.

I also have a friend who used to work at Kenmore He got on with fairly low time but was an A and P. He managed to never have to wrench for them but I think it helped him get hired. He went on to the airlines, too, but I know he did some part time work there in the summers. Maybe still does.

With your schedule and the right connections and experience, you could easily fit a part time Kenmore job into your life as a fire fighter.

[flyguy]

I really enjoy instructing. If for some reason I could not advance my career beyond what I am doing now, I would be okay with that. Don't get me wrong, I look forward to moving on, but I'm having the time of my life in the mean time. And if moving on is not all its cracked up to be, I may make instrucing my career. When you have a passion for something, and you are able to pass it on to others, its kind of a rush. At least that's how I percieve it.

[kellwolf]

Originally Posted by kevin7720

My questions are:

1. It seems that most people can't make a living wage instructing but if the pay was not a concern would there be more people making it a longer profession?

If the pay was higher, I can guarantee you'd see more people instructing. There are a lot of people that enjoy the flexibility of instructing and the fact that you're home every night. You get to set your own schedule (to some extent) and maintain a lot of control over your life.

2. Do you feel that being a CFI is a rewarding profession. Or is the profession only for building time and moving on?

Personally, I think if you approach instructing as solely a means of building time, you're cheating yourself and your students. I had days when I was ready to jump out of the job, but they were more than outnumbered by the days were I felt I truly got something out of it. Nothing beats the look on a student's face when they "get it" after all the hard work. If you approach instructing as a profession instead of a way to build time, you'll be surprised how much better your OWN skills become.

3. When you go to work being a CFI do you look forward to going to the airport? Keep in mind that I would try to limit sitting at the airport behind a desk waiting for someone to walk in to a minimum.

Some days yes, some days no. You're flying an airplane, but it's still a job. I haven't had a job yet that I can honestly say I didn't have days where I wanted to stay in bed. They're fewer than they were in my other jobs, though. After I got to work, I enjoyed myself. As far as not sitting behind the desk, you might have to do that for a while to get students. After that, if you're a good instructor, word of mouth might start drawing other students in.

4. Do you like working for an FBO or would it be better to seek being your own boss and taking all of the responsibilities of owning your own business.

While the FBO/flight school has the advantages of advertising, nothing beats being your own boss. Most FBOs hire you as an independent contractor, so you have a lot of those same freedoms as long as you iron out the details up front.

5. I am in the seattle area and I am not sure what CFI wages are for my area. I do know what the going rate is for instruction but don't know how much of it makes it to the instructor.

Advantages to freelancing is you generally get to keep all the money you charge. The disadvantage is that you might have to carry your own insurance, etc. You can set your own price based on what you and the student think is fair. The school I worked for charged around $40 and the instructors saw $17. The up side to that (if you can look at it this way) is we didn't have to do near as much advertising to draw students in, the school paid the insurance on us, and we had multiple planes to choose from (including twins). If you're not looking to make anything other than instructing a career, you can definately afford to pick and choose what's best for you. I'd highly suggest looking into freelancing.

Even though I'm at a regional right now, I still plan on keeping my CFI certs up to date. That way, if things go south or I decide I'd rather instruct, the option is still open to me.