CFI question?

[Chaz]

I had a question to those CFIs out there. Is spin training required by most schools for the CFI ratings? I was just wondering because I never had any intention of doing aerobatic manuevers to become a commercial/corporate/ or civilian pilot. It might sound strange, but I don't picture or fathom falling out of the sky unless my engine goes. To some it might seem thrilling, but not for me.

[Doug Taylor]

I thought my spin training was worthwhile. It's certainly something you'd want to experience under the watchful eye of a CFI in a training environment rather than trying to 'learn on the fly' if you encounter one.

I really don't plan on stalling aircraft as a professional pilot either, but I'm certainly glad I was trained on recovery.

[EatSleepFly]

[ QUOTE ]
Is spin training required by most schools for the CFI ratings?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, it's required by the FAA.

[ QUOTE ]
I was just wondering because I never had any intention of doing aerobatic manuevers to become a commercial/corporate/ or civilian pilot. It might sound strange, but I don't picture or fathom falling out of the sky unless my engine goes. To some it might seem thrilling, but not for me.

[/ QUOTE ]

You don't know what you're missing. Aerobatics WILL make you a better pilot.

[FOD]

Yes, spin training is required. Stall/Spin accidents account for a majority of training accidents, its something you should fully understand if your going to be an instructor. And something you should'nt be afraid of, most light training aircraft are extremly stable and make it very easy to recover from a spin. Get some good spin training, i bet you will enjoy it (most CFI's do, if its intentional).

[Chaz]

I just can't imagine nose diving 1500 ft down. It crosses that line of fun and craziness. Thats why I have no interest in aerobatic flying even if someone paid for my training. I understand why they do spin training but I'm not the guy that is going to do it on the weekend for fun. Is there anyone else in the same situation? This is off topic, but what are other feasible options beside going into the military or becoming a CFI to build flight time in for any professional career.

[Kingairer]

If you are going to be a CFI you need it! (not to mention its reqd). If you dont like it, just go up getrdone and youll never have to do one again.

[ryanmickG]

I do spin training with all my private students so they dont have that fear of the unknown feeling.

We have a DPE that will do them with PPL applicants if they have not done them yet.

[Doug Taylor]

I used to hate doing lazy 8's because they were difficult and I couldn't properly visualize the manuever. Plus, I wasn't planning on doing lazy 8's in a jetliner because I wanted to be a professional pilot.

But you cannot obtain a commercial certificate without showing proficiency in lazy 8's.

From spin training, from what I saw, if your first spin is an inadvertent entry, chances are by the time you recognize it, think back to what the book said about recovery, it's probably too late. With spin training, in my humble opinion, you have a tremendously greater likelihood of recovering.

[EatSleepFly]

[ QUOTE ]
I just can't imagine nose diving 1500 ft down. It crosses that line of fun and craziness. Thats why I have no interest in aerobatic flying even if someone paid for my training. I understand why they do spin training but I'm not the guy that is going to do it on the weekend for fun. Is there anyone else in the same situation? This is off topic, but what are other feasible options beside going into the military or becoming a CFI to build flight time in for any professional career.

[/ QUOTE ]

Must....bite....tongue.

[Screaming_Emu]

[ QUOTE ]
It might sound strange, but I don't picture or fathom falling out of the sky unless my engine goes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, most people that crash because of accidentally stalling/spinning a plane dont picture it either, thats probably part of the problem.

[KLB]

[ QUOTE ]
I do spin training with all my private students so they dont have that fear of the unknown feeling.

We have a DPE that will do them with PPL applicants if they have not done them yet.

[/ QUOTE ]

Graben does.

[Pilot Hopeful]

I was extremely nervous prior to my spin training for the CFI rating. Thanks to a proficient, competent and easy-going instructor, performing the spins was nearly a non-event. Indeed, I have been more afraid when the plane banks unexpectedly in a stall than I was intentionally performing spins in a C-152.

Perhaps you too will be less anxious after you have the opportunity to experience a spin first hand. Having a bit of trepidation of this flight realm is natural and will help keep you flying safe throughout your career.

[Chaz]

You guys sure make it seem comforting. Its just something I had never thought of until I looked at the requirements. By the way, how long does it normally take to recover from a spin or does that depend on many things. I almost rather do a barrell role than have to force myself into nosing the plane straight down. Thanks for the encouragement.

[jtrain609]

Spin+Cessna 172=non event

[sopdan]

[ QUOTE ]
Spin+Cessna 172=non event

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Absolutely. Actually, sometimes you have to try with all your might to even get it in, or keep it in a spin. More annoying than spooky.

And dude, if you're worried about performing a spin in a controlled environment with a competent instructor (and that's the only reason you don't want to be a CFI), then I'd say you should ask all of your previous CFIs why they never discussed the dangerous possibilities of flying with you. Intentional spins that are performed in a training environment are the least of your worries. To paraphrase Kingairer... just f'in do it.

[MikeD]

[ QUOTE ]
Spin+Cessna 172=non event

[/ QUOTE ]

Uhhhh..........caveat that "if performed correctly"

[MikeD]

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To paraphrase Kingairer... just f'in do it.

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Requirement is there. Buck up and meet the requirement for the ticket, or don't and get no ticket.

It's that simple.

Questions?

End of thread.

[Rocketman99]

Since you mentioned being a CFI or flying for the military I will offer this info. If you go the military route you will have to become proficient at acrobatic maneuvers and spins during the first phase of pilot training. You have to perform the acrobatic maneuvers and spins to set standards on one of your early checkrides.

Basically, there's pretty much no way around spinning. However, you will gain a lot from having had that training. Particularly in something like a 172. The plane practically flies itself out of the spin! Relax, even though it may not seem like it will be, it really is a lot of fun when you get there!

[kellwolf]

[ QUOTE ]
Uhhhh..........caveat that "if performed correctly"

[/ QUOTE ]

There's really only one way to do it (well, two, but you gotta time the "pop" on the elevator perfectly to spin power off), put the power full in, full right (or left) rudder, yoke in your lap, and start putting in a little aileron. Recovery = let the F go. Take out any of the control inputs, and it'll pop into a dive instead of a spin.

[sorrygottarunway]

just wait until your student doesn't add enough right rudder on a power on stall, then when the wing drops tries to recover with aileron.

[kellwolf]

Been there, done that, smacked him off the controls since he froze up...... Next crisis.

[MikeD]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Uhhhh..........caveat that "if performed correctly"

[/ QUOTE ]

There's really only one way to do it (well, two, but you gotta time the "pop" on the elevator perfectly to spin power off), put the power full in, full right (or left) rudder, yoke in your lap, and start putting in a little aileron. Recovery = let the F go. Take out any of the control inputs, and it'll pop into a dive instead of a spin.

[/ QUOTE ]

What I mean by "performed correctly" is, the people that don't do the above, and make the spin worse due to pilot input, and eventually structurally fail the plane.

The main focus of this thread is, do what's required for the rating or don't.

His choice.

[MidlifeFlyer]

[ QUOTE ]
You guys sure make it seem comforting. Its just something I had never thought of until I looked at the requirements. By the way, how long does it normally take to recover from a spin or does that depend on many things. I almost rather do a barrell role than have to force myself into nosing the plane straight down. Thanks for the encouragement.

[/ QUOTE ]It's really not as bad as you are picturing it.

Recovery is airplane-specific, but in the trainers most use, you're only doing a couple of turns to begin with and they recover very quickly.

FWIW, I don't really enjoy them myself. But by the time I did my training for the CFI, I knew what it was and why it was and I was with a CFI who I completely trusted. Did it once in a 152, but when my CFI gave me the endorsement, I told him I wanted to go up again. He asked why and I told him that I still didn't feel that I could demonstrate it if necessary and until I did, I didn't feel comfortable about it. So we went back up, this time in a Citabria.

In both cases, the recovery was very fast (less than a full turn).

I still am not a fan of spins. If I have a primary student who wants the experience, I send him up with a CFI who enjoys teaching them. But the training has come in very handy in teaching. If nothing else, it gives me the confidence to let a student go a little further than I might otherwise.

[BrettInLJ]

I must be crazy because my instructor showed be spins in a 150 Aerobat before I soloed and I couldn't wait. I thought they were fun, especially because the recovery was very straightforward. I did them again for commercial training in a Decathalon. I highly recommend going up in a plane such as that if you never have. If I had extra money to spend, I would take the aerobatic courses at a certain FBO at KSNA where I trained.

[Catherine]

[ QUOTE ]
just wait until your student doesn't add enough right rudder on a power on stall, then when the wing drops tries to recover with aileron.

[/ QUOTE ]

Woohoo!!!! That's what I said after my instructor showed me one of those and we went a good bit of the way around in the roll axis before the pitch dropped a good bit, then we recovered. I then made him do it again and let me use the controls.....wow....

I am looking forward to spin training and I'd love to get some acrobatic training after that. Is it a bit spooky? You bet! But if life were too boring, it wouldn't be much fun! It's great to face your fears and come out on top and be more proficient and able to deal with situations that could occur at some point.

Catherine