3 Resignation letters. . .

surreal1221 · May 10th, 2007, 15:38

May 03, 2007

Mr. Randall Park,

I am writing you today to officially tender my resignation from the Federal Aviation Administration - Oakland ARTCC effective Sunday, May 20, 2007.

Mr. Park, my family and I truly appreciate the insight and effort that you have put in to assist in this matter as well as the personal advice you have given to us. Thank you.

My decision to leave is based on:

My wife will be starting her new career at Salt Lake TRACON and under the transfer rules in the current contract I am unable to relocate with my family while maintaining my current position with the FAA.

My decision to move my wife and I to the Bay Area from New Mexico was largely based on the belief that I would be compensated according to the old AT Pay Plan under which I was hired. After living here for a year and with the new addition to our family we realized that our financial needs are much different then we had calculated. This couple with the FAA never giving me the pay I was promised has caused us what amounts to insurmountable financial harm. After careful thought my wife and I have decided that we can provide a better quality of life for ourselves and for our daughter in Utah.

The time I have spent here has been enjoyable, my training was conducted with the utmost professionalism, my peers have been great mentors and a joy to work with; for these reasons I will leave here with a very positive outlook on my future. My passion and career choice has been and always will be Air Traffic Control – that is why I regretfully and broken-heartedly turn in this letter.

Thank you for this opportunity.

If you have any questions, please ask.

Sincerely,

Donald Magley
----------------------------------------------------------------
April 16, 2007

Randy Park
Air Traffic Manager
5125 Central Ave.
Fremont, CA 94536

Re: Letter of Resignation

This letter serves as a formal resignation from my employment with the FAA. In early February mutual reassignments were agreed upon between the ZLA manager and the ZOA manager. The reason for the request was to be with my fiancé who works at ZLA. This swap entailed for me to transfer to ZLA and another developmental with like qualifications to transfer to ZOA. Despite the Unions best efforts to make this possible it was denied by the by the FAA’s Senior Advisor of the Western En Route & Oceanic Operations manager. He quoted the FAA’s Imposed Work Rules and stated that the swap would not be allowed. Because of this determination, I see no other options, which would benefit me or my family. Therefore, it is with great disappointment that I must submit this letter of resignation, terminating my current employment with the FAA.

Sincerely,

Timothy N McGuire
------------------------------------------------------------------
John Davydov

4/16/07
Mr. Steve Nauss
Title: ZOA / Support Manager For Training
Organization: ZOA ARTCC
Address: 5125 Central Ave Fremont, CA 94538

Dear Mr. Nauss,

I would like to inform you that, due to personal reasons; I am resigning from my position as Air Traffic Control Specialist on May 1st, 2007. I would like to thank you for the opportunities for professional and personal development that you have provided me during my last seven months of employment.

I have enjoyed working here at Oakland Center and appreciate the support provided to me during my time here at the facility. I still believe I can be a productive employee and an asset to the FAA. However, due to the FAA imposed work rules, cost of living in California, and developmental pay, coupled with my family concerns I am forced to relocate. According to the FAA, because of the imposed work rules I have been advised that it is impossible for me transfer from Oakland Center. Unfortunately, for the reasons that I listed above I will be forced to resign my position and relocate to the greater Miami area. I would like to be considered in the future, for other Air Traffic positions in the Miami area facilities.

I am only 22 years old; I have graduated from FAA CTI program from College of Aeronautics in New York, and have gained valuable experience at Oakland ARTCC. I know that I could be an asset to the Agency, and I am very interested in continuing a career with the FAA, should that opportunity become available within the greater Miami area.

Sincerely,

John Davydov
----------------------------------------

pilotnate23 · May 10th, 2007, 21:41

Is this really appropriate for a forum titled "ask an air traffic controller?" Are things rosey at the FAA? No, but there are labor issues in many organizations. One would be incredibly ignorant to expect to come into the FAA making a comfortable living and working easy hours. You have to work your way up just like a pilot or a doctor or a lawyer. Remember, there are people out there that enjoy working air traffic for the FAA and some who don't...different strokes for different folks and those decisions, either to stay or go, should be respected. I'm tired of hearing this personal agenda against the FAA.

Sidious · May 10th, 2007, 22:49

and at least take the names out, unless of course they don't mind.

pullup · May 10th, 2007, 23:29

What was the point of that?

TonyWilliams · May 11th, 2007, 01:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

One would be incredibly ignorant to expect to come into the FAA making a comfortable living and working easy hours.... I'm tired of hearing this personal agenda against the FAA.

So, what you're saying is that these three separate individuals are all looking for easy hours and good pay? Sorry, that's not what I read in them.

Yah, they must each have a "personal agenda".

Tony

Maximillian_Jenius · May 11th, 2007, 03:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

Is this really appropriate for a forum titled "ask an air traffic controller?" Are things rosey at the FAA? No, but there are labor issues in many organizations. One would be incredibly ignorant to expect to come into the FAA making a comfortable living and working easy hours. You have to work your way up just like a pilot or a doctor or a lawyer. Remember, there are people out there that enjoy working air traffic for the FAA and some who don't...different strokes for different folks and those decisions, either to stay or go, should be respected. I'm tired of hearing this personal agenda against the FAA.

Are you aware of all that controllers on the "A scale" have had to endure? Would you like to take a 40% pay cut and have harsh work rules forced on you and punished for taking days off, and work longer days for less pay?

Your post reeked of naivete!

Andrew_VT · May 11th, 2007, 09:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

Is this really appropriate for a forum titled "ask an air traffic controller?" Are things rosey at the FAA? No, but there are labor issues in many organizations.

I'm fighting the urge to use bad words here. This effects us all. If it wasn't for Surreal I wouldn't have a clue how low the FAA has sunk or how poorly controllers are treated...and my brother is in a CTI program!

Yes there are labor issues in aviation, but just because we've been de-sensitized to crooked/inept management in the regional world dosen't mean we shouldn't think its a big deal when this behavior appears in the FAA.

surreal1221 · May 11th, 2007, 10:22

These e-mails, were provided, by each controller to the NATCA Director of Communications, Doug Church. Doug then, sends out (nearly daily) Press releases to ALL Media members (of which, I also get these e-mails).

There are a number of members on this board who are, or have, contemplated joining the ranks of controllers currently working under ridiculous conditions at FAA facilities across the country.

In an attempt to stem any sort of kool-aid drinking that is coming out of OKC, I post these with respect to the authors, and in the hopes that individuals who are presently contemplating this career as a lifelong journey have all information available.

So - in the end - you don't like it? I'm sorry. Write Doug Church, but I will continue to post press releases, and any attachments that I find valid enough to post - right here.

asl · May 11th, 2007, 11:25

From what I read the point of these letters here - the FAA have imposed working condition rules that will lose controllers who want to be controllers because they have partners stationed elsewhere, when there is a nationwide shortage of controllers that isn't bad or inept it is assanine. Effectively you go where we tell you, not where you request. Now compare to the ATCO program in the UK - which offers same location requests for couples, opposing co-ordinated shifts for couples with young families (i.e. there's no childcare costs cos when one is working the other's at home and so on, and then joint rest days, so they can spend time as a couple) and joint holiday entitlement for couples (i.e. even if they are at the same ATC centre they can holiday at the same time as each other.
Now when you are short-staffed which one of these is going to keep more staff working??
Come on - it's not rocket science!!!
It looks like the FAA will have to learn their lesson the hard way - well so be it. The sooner they realise that the ATC's are their most valuable resource and like any other resource it needs sufficient maintenance to keep it running smoothly.
Personally I don't understand why with this sort of idiotic management the ATC's don't go out on strike, it is obviously the only thing the FAA will understand.

dbrault17 · May 11th, 2007, 11:53

didnt the last time the went on strike they were all fired and replaced? Im not sure thats why im asking.

surreal1221 · May 11th, 2007, 11:57

1981 - PATCO (the then union) went on strike, and Ronald Boy fired them all, and hired the bunch of guys who are coming up on retirement right now.

pilotnate23 · May 11th, 2007, 22:17

I know that the individuals that wrote those letters do not have a personal agenda. They're just doing what's best for them and their families. My point was simply to keep this forum a place for pilots to ask controllers about the things they've been asking (which has been a great addition here) and keep the political or personal agendas of some JC members out of it. There are other parts of the forums for that. Am I a little naive when it comes to FAA work rules...yes. Please forgive me, I'm coming here with a military ATC background where the working conditions are just as bad as far as manning and hours worked. A 40% pay cut? That's still probably more than military controllers, who sometimes have to get food stamps to feed their families, work long hours with no overtime, and get deployed to some exotic location for months at a stretch. There's always someone worse off.

Sidious · May 11th, 2007, 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by surreal1221

So - in the end - you don't like it? I'm sorry. Write Doug Church, but I will continue to post press releases, and any attachments that I find valid enough to post - right here.

Fair enough, I guess we all have to do what we feel is right

Maximillian_Jenius · May 12th, 2007, 01:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

I'm coming here with a military ATC background where the working conditions are just as bad as far as manning and hours worked. A 40% pay cut? That's still probably more than military controllers, who sometimes have to get food stamps to feed their families, work long hours with no overtime, and get deployed to some exotic location for months at a stretch. There's always someone worse off.

Eh, you signed up for that. Service to onces country though honorable will never make one wealthy.

The FAA controllers didn't enlist. They simply want honest work rules and pay commensurate with skill level, and the ability to provide a fair wage for themselves and their families!

mrivc211 · May 12th, 2007, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

Is this really appropriate for a forum titled "ask an air traffic controller?" Are things rosey at the FAA? No, but there are labor issues in many organizations. One would be incredibly ignorant to expect to come into the FAA making a comfortable living and working easy hours. You have to work your way up just like a pilot or a doctor or a lawyer. Remember, there are people out there that enjoy working air traffic for the FAA and some who don't...different strokes for different folks and those decisions, either to stay or go, should be respected. I'm tired of hearing this personal agenda against the FAA.

It seems to me these boys are just asking for what was promised to them by the FAA.

And by the way-you mentioned something about keeping these forums about pilots asking controllers only?

Imagine how many people would end up shooting themselves if they didn't have people on this website telling them about horrible pay and time away from home. Need I say more?

jonnyb · May 12th, 2007, 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrivc211

It seems to me these boys are just asking for what was promised to them by the FAA.

And by the way-you mentioned something about keeping these forums about pilots asking controllers only?

Imagine how many people would end up shooting themselves if they didn't have people on this website telling them about horrible pay and time away from home. Need I say more?

Exactly. This is what these forums are for.

Cruise · May 12th, 2007, 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

I know that the individuals that wrote those letters do not have a personal agenda. They're just doing what's best for them and their families. My point was simply to keep this forum a place for pilots to ask controllers about the things they've been asking (which has been a great addition here) and keep the political or personal agendas of some JC members out of it. There are other parts of the forums for that. Am I a little naive when it comes to FAA work rules...yes. Please forgive me, I'm coming here with a military ATC background where the working conditions are just as bad as far as manning and hours worked. A 40% pay cut? That's still probably more than military controllers, who sometimes have to get food stamps to feed their families, work long hours with no overtime, and get deployed to some exotic location for months at a stretch. There's always someone worse off.

Sorry, but I do not agree with your line of thinking here......although you, and everyone else, is entitled to their opinions.

First, just because the title of the forum is Ask an ATC......doesn't mean only questions should be posted.....instead, I am of the impression that anything ATC is relevant here.

Second, I'm sorry to hear about your situation as a military controller. But as Maxy said, you signed up for it. Doesn't mean you have to like the situation, but you do need to put up with it. Serving one's country is a very honorable thing to do, but if you're in it for the money, I've got some great swampland for sale....let me know.
Heck, with so many regional pilots on here who would also qualify for food stamps, I don't think you'll get much sympathy....but I could be wrong (it won't be the first or last time

). We all signed up to work at the regional level....doesn't mean we need to like the pay, but no one forced us to work here either.

Lastly, Surreal has posted many relavant and informative topics regarding the FAA and ATC situation. This is just one more....IMHO. It's not right when the government won't honor their contracts. But hey, when you're the government, you can do whatever you want, right?

Mr.Maximus · May 12th, 2007, 20:27

Personally, I am glad Surreal posted these letters. This is an aviation forum, and ATC is as much a part of the system as any of us pilots. We have a government force feeding lower wages, more hours, and an overall lousy work environment down the throats of a very critical piece of the aviation infrastructure. I noted the same general theme in the letters, and it sounded to me like they were ALL sorry to be leaving. No anger, no finger pointing, and no disrespect. These all sounded like normal people that have made the decision that family and the associated quality of life with family is more important than a job they love. And I hardly doubt any of them got into it for the money.

Funny, couple this with the problems at the majors, the pathetic race to the bottom within the regional industry and the up and coming FAA user fee's which will stifle at some point most from getting into the game - whatta ya have??? You have what used to be a proud profession, the best aviation system in the world being run like a third world country.

Well, in reality - not so funny.

Max

pilotnate23 · May 12th, 2007, 20:34

OK mercy...I'll just stick to answering the questions you guys have about how/why we do the things we do on the other side of the radio.

Cruise · May 12th, 2007, 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotnate23

OK mercy...I'll just stick to answering the questions you guys have about how/why we do the things we do on the other side of the radio.

Absolutely not, don't do that........you have every right to express your opinion on any subject. Unfortunately, not everyone is going to agree with everything you say.

By no means should you restrict offering your opinion. After all, that's what makes JC what it is!

SmitteyB · May 13th, 2007, 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by asl

From what I read the point of these letters here - the FAA have imposed working condition rules that will lose controllers who want to be controllers because they have partners stationed elsewhere, when there is a nationwide shortage of controllers that isn't bad or inept it is assanine. Effectively you go where we tell you, not where you request. Now compare to the ATCO program in the UK - which offers same location requests for couples, opposing co-ordinated shifts for couples with young families (i.e. there's no childcare costs cos when one is working the other's at home and so on, and then joint rest days, so they can spend time as a couple) and joint holiday entitlement for couples (i.e. even if they are at the same ATC centre they can holiday at the same time as each other.
Now when you are short-staffed which one of these is going to keep more staff working??
Come on - it's not rocket science!!!
It looks like the FAA will have to learn their lesson the hard way - well so be it. The sooner they realise that the ATC's are their most valuable resource and like any other resource it needs sufficient maintenance to keep it running smoothly.
Personally I don't understand why with this sort of idiotic management the ATC's don't go out on strike, it is obviously the only thing the FAA will understand.

Reminds me of....um....airlines.

May 10th, 2007, 15:38	#1
surreal1221 Old Skool Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Alpha Tango Lima Posts: 8,655	3 Resignation letters. . . May 03, 2007 Mr. Randall Park, I am writing you today to officially tender my resignation from the Federal Aviation Administration - Oakland ARTCC effective Sunday, May 20, 2007. Mr. Park, my family and I truly appreciate the insight and effort that you have put in to assist in this matter as well as the personal advice you have given to us. Thank you. My decision to leave is based on: My wife will be starting her new career at Salt Lake TRACON and under the transfer rules in the current contract I am unable to relocate with my family while maintaining my current position with the FAA. My decision to move my wife and I to the Bay Area from New Mexico was largely based on the belief that I would be compensated according to the old AT Pay Plan under which I was hired. After living here for a year and with the new addition to our family we realized that our financial needs are much different then we had calculated. This couple with the FAA never giving me the pay I was promised has caused us what amounts to insurmountable financial harm. After careful thought my wife and I have decided that we can provide a better quality of life for ourselves and for our daughter in Utah. The time I have spent here has been enjoyable, my training was conducted with the utmost professionalism, my peers have been great mentors and a joy to work with; for these reasons I will leave here with a very positive outlook on my future. My passion and career choice has been and always will be Air Traffic Control – that is why I regretfully and broken-heartedly turn in this letter. Thank you for this opportunity. If you have any questions, please ask. Sincerely, Donald Magley ---------------------------------------------------------------- April 16, 2007 Randy Park Air Traffic Manager 5125 Central Ave. Fremont, CA 94536 Re: Letter of Resignation This letter serves as a formal resignation from my employment with the FAA. In early February mutual reassignments were agreed upon between the ZLA manager and the ZOA manager. The reason for the request was to be with my fiancé who works at ZLA. This swap entailed for me to transfer to ZLA and another developmental with like qualifications to transfer to ZOA. Despite the Unions best efforts to make this possible it was denied by the by the FAA’s Senior Advisor of the Western En Route & Oceanic Operations manager. He quoted the FAA’s Imposed Work Rules and stated that the swap would not be allowed. Because of this determination, I see no other options, which would benefit me or my family. Therefore, it is with great disappointment that I must submit this letter of resignation, terminating my current employment with the FAA. Sincerely, Timothy N McGuire ------------------------------------------------------------------ John Davydov 4/16/07 Mr. Steve Nauss Title: ZOA / Support Manager For Training Organization: ZOA ARTCC Address: 5125 Central Ave Fremont, CA 94538 Dear Mr. Nauss, I would like to inform you that, due to personal reasons; I am resigning from my position as Air Traffic Control Specialist on May 1st, 2007. I would like to thank you for the opportunities for professional and personal development that you have provided me during my last seven months of employment. I have enjoyed working here at Oakland Center and appreciate the support provided to me during my time here at the facility. I still believe I can be a productive employee and an asset to the FAA. However, due to the FAA imposed work rules, cost of living in California, and developmental pay, coupled with my family concerns I am forced to relocate. According to the FAA, because of the imposed work rules I have been advised that it is impossible for me transfer from Oakland Center. Unfortunately, for the reasons that I listed above I will be forced to resign my position and relocate to the greater Miami area. I would like to be considered in the future, for other Air Traffic positions in the Miami area facilities. I am only 22 years old; I have graduated from FAA CTI program from College of Aeronautics in New York, and have gained valuable experience at Oakland ARTCC. I know that I could be an asset to the Agency, and I am very interested in continuing a career with the FAA, should that opportunity become available within the greater Miami area. Sincerely, John Davydov ---------------------------------------- __________________ AGI.MEI.CFI.CFII.FO.CRJ2 \| Josh \|The TRoP \| Ramble On \|ALPA \| Your DD-214 is where?

May 10th, 2007, 21:41	#2
pilotnate23 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: SD Posts: 98	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . Is this really appropriate for a forum titled "ask an air traffic controller?" Are things rosey at the FAA? No, but there are labor issues in many organizations. One would be incredibly ignorant to expect to come into the FAA making a comfortable living and working easy hours. You have to work your way up just like a pilot or a doctor or a lawyer. Remember, there are people out there that enjoy working air traffic for the FAA and some who don't...different strokes for different folks and those decisions, either to stay or go, should be respected. I'm tired of hearing this personal agenda against the FAA. __________________ "Two things make an airplane fly: airspeed and money"

May 10th, 2007, 22:49	#3
Sidious Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Titusville Posts: 367	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . and at least take the names out, unless of course they don't mind.

May 11th, 2007, 10:22	#8
surreal1221 Old Skool Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Alpha Tango Lima Posts: 8,655	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . These e-mails, were provided, by each controller to the NATCA Director of Communications, Doug Church. Doug then, sends out (nearly daily) Press releases to ALL Media members (of which, I also get these e-mails). There are a number of members on this board who are, or have, contemplated joining the ranks of controllers currently working under ridiculous conditions at FAA facilities across the country. In an attempt to stem any sort of kool-aid drinking that is coming out of OKC, I post these with respect to the authors, and in the hopes that individuals who are presently contemplating this career as a lifelong journey have all information available. So - in the end - you don't like it? I'm sorry. Write Doug Church, but I will continue to post press releases, and any attachments that I find valid enough to post - right here. __________________ AGI.MEI.CFI.CFII.FO.CRJ2 \| Josh \|The TRoP \| Ramble On \|ALPA \| Your DD-214 is where?

May 11th, 2007, 11:25	#9
asl Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Dartford,UK (near London) Posts: 241	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . From what I read the point of these letters here - the FAA have imposed working condition rules that will lose controllers who want to be controllers because they have partners stationed elsewhere, when there is a nationwide shortage of controllers that isn't bad or inept it is assanine. Effectively you go where we tell you, not where you request. Now compare to the ATCO program in the UK - which offers same location requests for couples, opposing co-ordinated shifts for couples with young families (i.e. there's no childcare costs cos when one is working the other's at home and so on, and then joint rest days, so they can spend time as a couple) and joint holiday entitlement for couples (i.e. even if they are at the same ATC centre they can holiday at the same time as each other. Now when you are short-staffed which one of these is going to keep more staff working?? Come on - it's not rocket science!!! It looks like the FAA will have to learn their lesson the hard way - well so be it. The sooner they realise that the ATC's are their most valuable resource and like any other resource it needs sufficient maintenance to keep it running smoothly. Personally I don't understand why with this sort of idiotic management the ATC's don't go out on strike, it is obviously the only thing the FAA will understand.

May 11th, 2007, 11:53	#10
dbrault17 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 258	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . didnt the last time the went on strike they were all fired and replaced? Im not sure thats why im asking.

May 11th, 2007, 11:57	#11
surreal1221 Old Skool Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Alpha Tango Lima Posts: 8,655	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . 1981 - PATCO (the then union) went on strike, and Ronald Boy fired them all, and hired the bunch of guys who are coming up on retirement right now. __________________ AGI.MEI.CFI.CFII.FO.CRJ2 \| Josh \|The TRoP \| Ramble On \|ALPA \| Your DD-214 is where?

May 11th, 2007, 22:17	#12
pilotnate23 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: SD Posts: 98	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . I know that the individuals that wrote those letters do not have a personal agenda. They're just doing what's best for them and their families. My point was simply to keep this forum a place for pilots to ask controllers about the things they've been asking (which has been a great addition here) and keep the political or personal agendas of some JC members out of it. There are other parts of the forums for that. Am I a little naive when it comes to FAA work rules...yes. Please forgive me, I'm coming here with a military ATC background where the working conditions are just as bad as far as manning and hours worked. A 40% pay cut? That's still probably more than military controllers, who sometimes have to get food stamps to feed their families, work long hours with no overtime, and get deployed to some exotic location for months at a stretch. There's always someone worse off.

May 12th, 2007, 20:27	#18
Mr.Maximus Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: This One Posts: 289	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . Personally, I am glad Surreal posted these letters. This is an aviation forum, and ATC is as much a part of the system as any of us pilots. We have a government force feeding lower wages, more hours, and an overall lousy work environment down the throats of a very critical piece of the aviation infrastructure. I noted the same general theme in the letters, and it sounded to me like they were ALL sorry to be leaving. No anger, no finger pointing, and no disrespect. These all sounded like normal people that have made the decision that family and the associated quality of life with family is more important than a job they love. And I hardly doubt any of them got into it for the money. Funny, couple this with the problems at the majors, the pathetic race to the bottom within the regional industry and the up and coming FAA user fee's which will stifle at some point most from getting into the game - whatta ya have??? You have what used to be a proud profession, the best aviation system in the world being run like a third world country. Well, in reality - not so funny. Max

May 12th, 2007, 20:34	#19
pilotnate23 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: SD Posts: 98	Re: 3 Resignation letters. . . OK mercy...I'll just stick to answering the questions you guys have about how/why we do the things we do on the other side of the radio. __________________ "Two things make an airplane fly: airspeed and money"

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