Going Direct

[Avi8er10]

So, a few weeks ago I was flying from GEG-SEA and over the radio the controller cleared a United flight direct to Janesville. So that got me to thinking. What does the controller do or how do they know if they can clear a flight direct to a fix/navaid that is hundreds of miles away? Did the Seattle Center controller call Chicago Center and ask or do they put the request in the computer and it decides if it can work? I am assuming that they have to talk to someone to see if it is OK to do that.

Thanks!

[ATC RET 2003]

Routings are usually done with either a written or verbal agreement between 2 sectors/facilities. Direct routings (especially long-range ones) were almost always coordinated verbally.... but we would usually stick to the pref routes and STARS during the day and evening shifts and on the mid shift, the standard was everybody goes direct. This was always accomplished by calling the next sector(s) at the beginning of the shift and working out a "blanket" agreement for the duration of the shift. Part of the agreement was that each of us would work out the approval "down the line".

I worked exclusively in the Southeastern US so can't speak for the part of the country you mentioned, but I wouldn't think that Seattle did any actual coordinating with Chicago... rather they probably worked it out with Salt Lake who in turn worked it out with Minneapolis who did the talking to Chicago.

I don't know what the timeframe was in your scenario, but maybe in that part of the country they can do direct routings more often than just on the mid.

As for equipment that assists in determining if the routing will work, we could enter the flight as direct to XYZ and that would take care of our facility for sure, but you never really could be certain of how the routing would be processed by the next centers down the line.

There is a gizmo called URET (User Request Evaluation Tool) that was implemented in my final facility long after I was gone, so I don't have any working knowledge of it. Maybe someone who is still working can shed some light on it as it pertains to your question... Fox Xray comes to mind.

[Ian J]

On that subject, I've been given direct routings (without me asking) to navaids a 100 miles away, or to random intersections when I wasn't on an airway. This is in slant Uniform aircraft. Is ATC just used to slant Golfs or better and overlook my lack of equipment to go direct?

When I tell them unable, slant U, they usually say "oh... okay..." and clear me somewhere I can actually navigate to. But it seems like they they didn't know I didn't have a GPS or something.

[Avi8er10]

Thanks for the reply. This happened around 530am so that is probably why it wasn't a problem. Makes sense to me now.

[ATC RET 2003]

Originally Posted by ChinookDriver

On that subject, I've been given direct routings (without me asking) to navaids a 100 miles away, or to random intersections when I wasn't on an airway. This is in slant Uniform aircraft. Is ATC just used to slant Golfs or better and overlook my lack of equipment to go direct?

When I tell them unable, slant U, they usually say "oh... okay..." and clear me somewhere I can actually navigate to. But it seems like they they didn't know I didn't have a GPS or something.

I believe you have hit the nail on the head... at least it was often that way for me. I entered the FAA in the previous century when RNAV was, as Brisco would say, "a coming thing." Also an ever-expanding thing at the time was automated radar systems, which for me, shifted my focus from that bank of strips with ALL the flight data printed and written on them to the brand new radar scope with a GOOD BIT of flight data (but NOT equipment suffixes) right there on it in a nifty thing called a data block.

Meanwhile, in not too long of a time, nearly everybody gained the capability of going direct anywhere. The trap I fell in most often was getting so used to the new breed of airplane that I forgot about the aging ones that were headed out to pasture soon enough that they didn't merit an avionics upgrade.

Immediately after cutting a few miles off the trip by clearing someone direct to a fix and getting the reply, "Thanks but can't do that..." , I'd cut a glance over at the strip bay and sure enough... right there it was in bold type... "/A".

[JHines]

I sometimes got cleared direct destination flying /U equipment as well. It's interesting to see ATC RET 2003's comments, as I always had the impression that a lot of pilots (I'm talking GA here) without /G were "cheating" their way through the system with handhelds, etc. and getting ATC thinking along the lines of everybody going direct everywhere.

The other thing that often happened to me was that I would file airways, or a "proper" RNAV flight plan in a /G plane, and then (enroute) get voluntarily cleared direct destination by ATC.

I guess they were being nice, but it had the effect (1) of essentially negating GPS and ground-based nav as effective backups to each other, and defeating the guaranteed airway ground clearance and radio reception; and (2) putting me headed to the wrong place (i.e. the destination rather than the IAF) in a no-radar/lost-comm situation.

[pilotnate23]

At my facility we coordinate with the sector above us and if they give the OK, we give them a direct routing to their requested fix. I'm all about direct routings but sometimes non-radar stuff gets into the picture...if so, then direct routing is very, very tough to come by.

[casey]

Originally Posted by JHines

I guess they were being nice, but it had the effect (1) of essentially negating GPS and ground-based nav as effective backups to each other, and defeating the guaranteed airway ground clearance and radio reception; and (2) putting me headed to the wrong place (i.e. the destination rather than the IAF) in a no-radar/lost-comm situation.

1) your GPS is backed up by ATC radar. Your ground clearance is guaranteed by the offroute grid MORAs on your chart. If you are going to enter an area of poor comms ATC will tell you "if radio comm is lost contact xyz center in 20 nm on 123.45" (i've gotten this in kansas city centers airspace at lower altitudes).

2) assuming IMC, fly to your clearance limit (airport) and then to an IAF and fly an approach.

[JHines]

Originally Posted by casey

1) your GPS is backed up by ATC radar. Your ground clearance is guaranteed by the offroute grid MORAs on your chart. If you are going to enter an area of poor comms ATC will tell you "if radio comm is lost contact xyz center in 20 nm on 123.45" (i've gotten this in kansas city centers airspace at lower altitudes).

2) assuming IMC, fly to your clearance limit (airport) and then to an IAF and fly an approach.

Yes, I understand there are practical "plan B" procedures. My point is, radar isn't an on-board backup (as required if using GPS). In a piston single, a non-redundant GPS may be the only RNAV equipment on board.

I think the workload to cross-check the GPS against ground-based nav, and maintain a position fix at all times, is a whole a lot lower on-airway than off. Granted, this depends on the navaid coverage in a particular area.

As to #2, I agree that's the correct NORDO procedure but it could put you in an awkward position relative to the established arrival/departure flows, and could easily be 10 extra NM from the aiport to the IAF. I guess if offered "direct KXYZ" a person could request "direct IAF for KXYZ".

Not really complaining, I just try to follow AIM/FAR IFR procedures closely. I think it helps a non-professional pilot avoid a lot of problems. Maybe I drink too much of the "Don Brown" Kool-Aide.

[calcapt]

Be very careful in executing what you think you hear. For example, I have received many clearances that say: "Continental 101, you are cleared to ABC intersection, descend and maintain 10,000 feet." Mind you they did not say that you are cleared "Direct" to ABC. The above clearance is usually a clearance limit and it is issued assuming that you will proceed to ABC intersection via your last assigned route. The danger comes when you type in ABC direct and begin your descent to 10,000 feet. You are now off your assigned route and you assume the controller would not descend you below a safe altitude but the controller has no idea you are turning direct. One can see the potential danger in a scenario like this. This happens more in places like Central and South America but could happen anywhere. Listen carefully and always ask if you are not sure.

[Rayflyoz]

Good point.

[flyguy]

Originally Posted by Ian J

On that subject, I've been given direct routings (without me asking) to navaids a 100 miles away, or to random intersections when I wasn't on an airway. This is in slant Uniform aircraft. Is ATC just used to slant Golfs or better and overlook my lack of equipment to go direct?

When I tell them unable, slant U, they usually say "oh... okay..." and clear me somewhere I can actually navigate to. But it seems like they they didn't know I didn't have a GPS or something.

That's common. I've had the same problem numerous times.

[exleardriver]

on the subject of a 'slant/u' or 'slant/a' aircraft, they may be cleared 'direct' to a navaid by the following verbiage, and in fact may request as follows: 'xyz center, cessna abc requests def vor when able'. this can cut some time off of your long victor airway routing if the def vor is a good ways away. atc would respond, 'cessna abc, fly heading xxx, direct def when able'. this is a vector clearance permitting a non-slant/g a/c to fly direct once within the working service volume and receiving the navaid morse code ident with no nav flag. just how far away along your route that the controller is willing to 'vector you direct' to a navaid may be dependent upon what agreement that center controller has with further center controllers in whose airspace you're requesting the 'heading direct when able' clearance.

[falconvalley]

We get alot of "when able"s in the Beech up here, north of O'hare.

[Fox Xray]

It seems like there are a lot of Jetstream 31's flying charter work and they are all /A's ... common for them to get fly heading XXX ABC when able.

They seem to be about the only /A's I see often anymore. Even the C172's lately all seem to be RNAV equipped... LOL.

[Baronman]

Originally Posted by calcapt

This happens more in places like Central and South America but could happen anywhere. Listen carefully and always ask if you are not sure.

Adding a little to this...In Mexico, let's say you're going from ASUTA intersection down to Mazatlan, and right when you check on with Mazatlan Center you ask, "Can we get direct Mazatlan?" They might come back and say, "Cleared direct to Mazatlan," or "Cleared to Mazatlan." You want to verify, "Are we cleared present position direct to Mazatlan?"

They will give you a clearance further along your route, not necessarily the present position "direct" that we're accustomed to. It's not a big deal once you realize the nuance.

[exleardriver]

Originally Posted by Fox Xray

It seems like there are a lot of Jetstream 31's flying charter work and they are all /A's ... common for them to get fly heading XXX ABC when able.

They seem to be about the only /A's I see often anymore. Even the C172's lately all seem to be RNAV equipped... LOL.

oh yeah..a decade ago i was flying 20-series freight learjets into canadian airports in particular using decades-old adf's for nighttime, windy and snowy ndb approaches. god i miss the the excitement...lmao. in some of them, we were 'lucky' to be /a. lol. what's gps??