Sorry, yet another color blindness Question

[hotcoffee]

I'm sure some of you guys have to be getting tired of these questions, but before I got my membership to post here I was sure to read every post on the topic thus far. However, I still have some questions.

Now, I am planning on starting training at a local flight school soon to get all my ratings and start a career in aviation. Now when I take color blindness tests like the Ishihara test here http://www.toledo-bend.com/colorblind/Ishihara.html I can get the 25, the 29, the 56, and the 8. However, the 56 and 25 are the only ones that really stand out to me. I've never had one of these tests officially administered, so before I get my medical done by the AME I'm thinking about getting this test administered by a normal eye doctor first to see how I do.

As far as my color blindness goes, it is only a slight amount of color blindness. Red and green lights I have no problem distinguishing (at least with lights on boats and traffic lights that is). It is the white and green lights I can sometimes have problems distinguishing, but usually I can get them right.

So if I fail the test done by the eye doctor (which I think I will) I live by a couple medical schools so I think I could find someone to administer the Farnsworth Lantern test. It is my understanding via the posts on this board that the Farnsworth test would be the best way to go as a second step since I can take it as many times as I need to by a normal eye doctor before I pass it (once again, just my understanding thus far, correct me if I am wrong). I can also probably get the local airport where I will be doing my training to let me get a test run of the ramp light test. It isn't very busy there and they're pretty much willing to do anything to get me to go there (mucho $$$ if they do, ha).

So anyway, it would be very much appreciated if you folks can look at my little plan here and tell me if there is any other better way of taking care of this issue. I'm pretty sure I will be able to pass at least one of those tests because I really dont have that big of a problem. For example I can see the boat lights like I said at night and I can easily see traffic lights as green and such. Thanks.

[abp]

[quote=hotcoffee].

Now when I take color blindness tests like the Ishihara test here http://www.toledo-bend.com/colorblind/Ishihara.html I can get the 25, the 29, the 56, and the 8. However, the 56 and 25 are the only ones that really stand out to me.
As far as my color blindness goes, it is only a slight amount of color blindness. Red and green lights I have no problem distinguishing (at least with lights on boats and traffic lights that is). It is the white and green lights I can sometimes have problems distinguishing, but usually I can get them right.

QUOTE]


Yup, a lot has been posted on this but that's because it's a ***** of a situation that effects many of us. Okay, you do have options. In regards to that website you showed -- I can see the exact same as you. A couple of them pop-out and others I can 'see' the pattern of where it is going and how they are trying to decieve you. That said, those websites (your monitor) do not replicate the lighting conditions that is 'suppose to be administered' during the testing. Thus, everytime I've taken the Ishihara in a doctors office I've failed it. However, my last medical I passed the color vision as it was done through a vision test in which I looked into a computer -- with my head rested on the pad etc. I do not know what test it was though.

In regards to being able to see the nav. lights on planes, or boats for that matter, I have found this to not AT ALL be representative to what these color vision tests are suppose to be screening for. Let me rephrase that; I have 600 hours with a 100 or so at night and have NEVER had problems distinquishing the beacon or nav lights -- but I have a hell of a time passing these color vision tests. So my point, don't look at 'real life applciations' and assume that the color vision test is going to mimic that in anyway. They don't, and that is what pisses me off about the whole thing.

Now, that brings me to the Farnsworth. Yup, that test is out there and if you pass it once, you get a letter from OKC that states your exempt from further CV testing and never have to take it again. Secondly, yes, you can take the F.W. more than once -- seems strange, but that apparently is the process. I took it, and passed. To be honest, it wasn't easy for me. The first several combinations were simple -- red over white, green over white etc-- but then they start to really dim the red-green-white lights and that makes it difficult -- your about 9 feet away from the machine and the lights are staggered on top of one in another. Their each about the size of an eraser on a #2 pencil. So, at 9 feet it can be tough when they dim the lights and you have to call "white over green".

My recommendations:

- DO NOT take a medical until you attempt every approved FAA color vision test. For anyone that has dealt with OKC and the medical division, they will tell you it can take an extemely long periods of time to get anything done. You will be caught in FAA medical hell. Don't put yourself in that situation -- just yet anyway.

- If you can't find any of the alt. tests (there are about 10 or so) check out some of the websites that help pilots deal with this -- such as pilot medical solutions -- or something like that. I know a guy who was in this situation, it cost him 40 bucks and they were really good at helping him through the whole process.

- Go to a class D tower and have them shoot the light gun at you. I believe for the SODA you have to do it at 700 and 1200 feet. BUT, do this as a last resort. Also, no, I the light gun is not a very accurate depiction of the Farnsworth. Even though that is partially what they are trying to duplicate -- the farnsworth is tougher.

Anyway, I know this whole situation is not fun. The bright side is that there are definately options that will enable you to get your 1st class unrestricted. Let me know if you have any other questions.

ABP

[cessna2351]

Hi there,

I personally have beaten this topic to death so I'd be glad to help another one of my colorblind bretheren

On that same test I can only see the 25 and the 8. In the 29 circle I see a 70 which is really what colorblind people are supposed to see. So I guess you might not be as severe as I am. Here is a website which I feel gives a better demonstration of the Ishihara test because they circles look like photocopies.

http://www.robinsonscamera.ca/
Click on the "Did You Know" Link on the left.

Another cool test is called the color vision recorder which tests you on the Farnsworth D-15 peg test on your computer. The D-15 is no longer an approved FAA test but it is still good at diagnosing. You can download a one week trial of it here.

http://www.opticaldiagnostics.com/products/cvr/

On your remark about traffic lights, I can tell the difference between red and green however sometimes at night, green traffic lights look practically white to me.

I took a modified version of the Farnsworth in July for my ATC vision testing and thought it was impossible. After awhile all of those little dots looked the same and I felt like I was having a seizure in that dark room. I know JC user Looking4Lower has passed the Farnsworth and is a great deal of information on the subject. I've yet to fix my pilot medical ( I went to a DPE who passed me when he shouldn't have but I didnt know it at the time, The Great Lakes Region Medical office, when I went into to take my ATC vision testing, were not very pleased with him and told me he would be taken care of).

Anyway, I would recommend looking for doctors (not examiners) on your own dime, who offer the alternative color vision tests and ask to be adminstered them. If you find any that work, you can use that for a waiver. I'll let some of the other guys give their feedback too.

Also, if you are seemingly stuck, consult www.aviationmedicine.com. They have a wealth of information on their site about colorvision and aviation and were a great help to me this summer when I needed to get tested for ATC. It was well worth the 40 bucks.

Go to a class D tower and have them shoot the light gun at you. I believe for the SODA you have to do it at 700 and 1200 feet. BUT, do this as a last resort. Also, no, I the light gun is not a very accurate depiction of the Farnsworth. Even though that is partially what they are trying to duplicate -- the farnsworth is tougher.

Yes, do this as a last resort. If you fail once, you might be given a second chance but if you fail twice its a permenant restriction.


Hope this helps a bit.