Decided not to go to ATP goodbye $2000

[DenverPilot8]

Well I had a class date of March 3rd but now I'm going to pass on that. I will lose $2000 for giving up this class date. The more I look into it I just can't justify the 60k in debt with the earning potential. With age 65 and a longer FO pay as well it just doesn't seem like I need to be at an airline in 3 months. I ended my current sales job this year with a 70k year. They give me a car to drive around also. So I've decided to work and get my ratings here in Denver. If all of my calculations are correct I'm looking at spending 38k all the way through MEI. I'll decide at that point if I want to take it futher than that. I will be losing Multi time however as I will finish with only 50 hours of multi and 250 hours TT. But I'm thinking that with the earning potential of my current job this is just a better option for me. I guess the point of it all is that after literally 2 years of saving money and working towards this I got a little bit of TUNNEL VISION. Yes it is a passion but i think we have to take a minute sometimes and put things into perspective.

Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against anyone who chooses ATP. Heck I'm losing a $2000 deposit!!! I still think it is a good option. But I couldn't justify that kind of debt to earnings ratio no matter how much I love flying.

I wish everyone who is starting all of this the best of luck in their training. I will be starting my instrument next week.

[blee256]

I think it was a very smart move on your part. I went to ATP. its a great school. but the loan payments are killer. especially on FO pay. Not getting into debt and getting your ratings is the best way to go. Good luck on your training.

[DE727UPS]

I think you're making a wise move to stick with the well paying job for a couple more years. You can get training as good, possibly better, with your local FBO. And it will not cost you as much. There are ways to build some quality multi out there, too. Stay tuned....

[t-cart]

I think you have made a very wise decision.Good for you! T.C.

[v1valarob]

Good decision. With a job like that, its well worth it. It would be hard for most to even switch careers from a 70k a year to 20k a year. By the time people start making that, their lifestyle has changed completely.

Just sucks that you cant get your $2k back.

-Rob

[DenverPilot8]

Thanks. Honestly the last 2 years have been a friggin journey. I moved back to Denver from San Diego (which I loved) so I could save money with a lower cost of living for flight school. I worked a corporate sales job and delivered chinese food at night so I would have more money to put towards this. I then invested in a codo property got a new job and saved another 15k on top of what I already had for this. I have to say that Jetcareers has been such a great resource for me as a whole (not to mention addicting). I am disapointed a little bit as I was really looking forward to going to ATP. But in the end I kept running the numbers and they just didn't add up for me. Thanks for the encouragement and take care!

[v1valarob]

Originally Posted by DenverPilot8

Thanks. Honestly the last 2 years have been a friggin journey. I moved back to Denver from San Diego (which I loved) so I could save money with a lower cost of living for flight school. I worked a corporate sales job and delivered chinese food at night so I would have more money to put towards this. I then invested in a codo property got a new job and saved another 15k on top of what I already had for this. I have to say that Jetcareers has been such a great resource for me as a whole (not to mention addicting). I am disapointed a little bit as I was really looking forward to going to ATP. But in the end I kept running the numbers and they just didn't add up for me. Thanks for the encouragement and take care!

Have you tried actually calling Jim K and asking for your money back? I mean damn, March is still 2 months out.

-Rob

[blee256]

Originally Posted by v1valarob

Have you tried actually calling Jim K and asking for your money back? I mean damn, March is still 2 months out.

-Rob

HAHAHAHAHAHA! LOL~~~ thats a good one.

[surreal1221]

GREAT decision!

[whichwayisup]

Good decision.

[jetguy35]

Why is everyone so against the whole going to ATP? Flight training costs a lot of money no matter where you go. I think its a personal preferance on how you want to learn. Fast or slow. Structured or unstructured. I just spoke to an american eagle pilot who attended ATP's 90 day course a couple years ago. He said it was the best choice he ever made. The reason I am going to ATP is for the following reason. I have very little student loans from school. A couple of my buddies are going to school and are going to have a butt load of students loans when they are done. And that is just for education. They aren't pilots or anything. Their loans will be more than my ATP bill. So that reason really persuaded me to follow my aviation dream.

Ben

[blee256]

Originally Posted by jetguy35

Why is everyone so against the whole going to ATP? Flight training costs a lot of money no matter where you go. I think its a personal preferance on how you want to learn. Fast or slow. Structured or unstructured. I just spoke to an american eagle pilot who attended ATP's 90 day course a couple years ago. He said it was the best choice he ever made. The reason I am going to ATP is for the following reason. I have very little student loans from school. A couple of my buddies are going to school and are going to have a butt load of students loans when they are done. And that is just for education. They aren't pilots or anything. Their loans will be more than my ATP bill. So that reason really persuaded me to follow my aviation dream.

Ben

Hey Ben

No one is against going to ATP in this thread, well maybe DE727UPS is, haha. I went to ATP, i enjoyed my time there. Got great training and I'm at an airline now. However with my training, I accrued a lot of debt. DenverPIlot is in a position to get to the airlines (if thats what he wants) without going into debt. SO when we say great job for not going to ATP, we are saying great job on making a sound financial decision. Not Great job for not going to ATP because we think they are a crappy school. They arent by any means. It was a matter of money. not necessarily the flight school itself.

[atpwannabe]

My reasons for wanting to attend is that for number one, I'm 46. Seniority is EVERYTHING!!! Everybody's situation is different. Second, is that I will have zero, $0.00, goose egg.......that's right boyz.....no debt after flight training. Going to ATP with Cashier's Check in hand. I'm blessed and very fortunate. However, I still have a $416.33/mo student loan pymt, car pymt--$321.00/mo that I'll be paying for another 15-20 yrs and 5 yrs respectively.

Oh well, can't have ya cake....and eat it too!



atp

[jetguy35]

Yeah, I think you're right in the financial aspect. I mean, it's a lot of money. Trust me, I have run the numbers over and over. I have weighed in the thought of having such a large debt to pay back. I came to my own financial decision and decided it was the right move for me to go to ATP. I am young and figured that every month or year that I take not trying to get to the airlines is one month or years worth of pay at the end of my aviation career that I will be missing out on. So by me trying to save $20,000 by not going to ATP right now would cost me that amount and more at the end of my career. My dad and bro are both pilots. My dad's with eagle and my brother is with republic. They have both kind of helped me make my decision. Most airline pilots I have talked to have really encouraged me to go to ATP. There is lots of value (multi time). One of the really nice aspects of ATP is the fact that they hire most guys back as instructors after completing the program. That's 2G's a month in your pocket plus the added bonus of building more and more multi time. Anyways, I'm going to bed. Talk to you guys tomorrow!

Ben

[DenverPilot8]

Originally Posted by jetguy35

Yeah, I think you're right in the financial aspect. I mean, it's a lot of money. Trust me, I have run the numbers over and over. I have weighed in the thought of having such a large debt to pay back. I came to my own financial decision and decided it was the right move for me to go to ATP. I am young and figured that every month or year that I take not trying to get to the airlines is one month or years worth of pay at the end of my aviation career that I will be missing out on. So by me trying to save $20,000 by not going to ATP right now would cost me that amount and more at the end of my career. My dad and bro are both pilots. My dad's with eagle and my brother is with republic. They have both kind of helped me make my decision. Most airline pilots I have talked to have really encouraged me to go to ATP. There is lots of value (multi time). One of the really nice aspects of ATP is the fact that they hire most guys back as instructors after completing the program. That's 2G's a month in your pocket plus the added bonus of building more and more multi time. Anyways, I'm going to bed. Talk to you guys tomorrow!

Ben

Yeah I kinda went through the same stuff. I thought about the opportunity costs of the lost seniority at the airlines. But in the end my current salary out weighed that by a large margin. There is of course the passion factor which lets face it is the reason why we all make such large sacrifices to pursue this career (why else would you do it). But no amount of financial voodoo could bring the numbers in my favor. I still think ATP is a good value however. It really comes down to that specific persons situation.

I asked and got denied a refund on my $2000 deposit. They did tell me that I would have to be dying or have somekind of emergency to get it back beforehand. It was worth a try though.

[v1valarob]

Originally Posted by DenverPilot8

Yeah I kinda went through the same stuff. I thought about the opportunity costs of the lost seniority at the airlines. But in the end my current salary out weighed that by a large margin. There is of course the passion factor which lets face it is the reason why we all make such large sacrifices to pursue this career (why else would you do it). But no amount of financial voodoo could bring the numbers in my favor. I still think ATP is a good value however. It really comes down to that specific persons situation.

I asked and got denied a refund on my $2000 deposit. They did tell me that I would have to be dying or have somekind of emergency to get it back beforehand. It was worth a try though.

What about asking to get that $2000 turned into some other rating. Maybe a commercial multi add-on with ATP. Or am I grasping?

-Rob

[juxtapilot]

Originally Posted by v1valarob

What about asking to get that $2000 turned into some other rating. Maybe a commercial multi add-on with ATP. Or am I grasping?

-Rob

This might not be a bad idea... Definatly talk to them and see what your options are.

[jima7011]

Originally Posted by DenverPilot8

Well I had a class date of March 3rd but now I'm going to pass on that. I will lose $2000 for giving up this class date. The more I look into it I just can't justify the 60k in debt with the earning potential. With age 65 and a longer FO pay as well it just doesn't seem like I need to be at an airline in 3 months. I ended my current sales job this year with a 70k year. They give me a car to drive around also. So I've decided to work and get my ratings here in Denver. If all of my calculations are correct I'm looking at spending 38k all the way through MEI. I'll decide at that point if I want to take it futher than that. I will be losing Multi time however as I will finish with only 50 hours of multi and 250 hours TT. But I'm thinking that with the earning potential of my current job this is just a better option for me. I guess the point of it all is that after literally 2 years of saving money and working towards this I got a little bit of TUNNEL VISION. Yes it is a passion but i think we have to take a minute sometimes and put things into perspective.

Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against anyone who chooses ATP. Heck I'm losing a $2000 deposit!!! I still think it is a good option. But I couldn't justify that kind of debt to earnings ratio no matter how much I love flying.

I wish everyone who is starting all of this the best of luck in their training. I will be starting my instrument next week.

I know exactly what you are talking about--I decided the same thing for the same reason-plus I talked to my current instructor and we "clicked" and that's kind of tough to find---I would've done the ATP thing (maybe) if I had the cash in hand but I'm not taking 70K loans at this stage of my life. So far I'm pretty happy with my decision.

[N826AW]

Sounds like you went with what you thought was best for you and that's never a bad decision.

Just out of curiosity, given your earning ability at your current job, was part of your decision because you're having second thoughts about heading to an airline with your ratings?

[DenverPilot8]

Originally Posted by N826AW

Sounds like you went with what you thought was best for you and that's never a bad decision.

Just out of curiosity, given your earning ability at your current job, was part of your decision because you're having second thoughts about heading to an airline with your ratings?

Yeah my earning potential at my currently job certainly was a big factor. But I have never really waivored on my intention to make flying a career. It is something that I have been sure about for a very lont time. But watching the industry on a daily bases really made me think twice about my timing. Although there is kind of a rush to "get on" before the hiring boom ends. I have felt pressure that same way that everyone else has in saying that the sooner I get to the airlines the sooner I build seniority. But in the end I decided to be more financially stable and get to the airlines when I get there. If they are no longer hiring when I finish my ratings then I will deal with that as it comes.

[wrxpilot]

Originally Posted by DenverPilot8

So I've decided to work and get my ratings here in Denver. If all of my calculations are correct I'm looking at spending 38k all the way through MEI. I'll decide at that point if I want to take it futher than that. I will be losing Multi time however as I will finish with only 50 hours of multi and 250 hours TT. But I'm thinking that with the earning potential of my current job this is just a better option for me.

Smart man. I did the same thing and don't regret it. Trust me, it is so much better to be debt free while doing this pilot thing. A lot more options are available to you, and you don't feel rushed into making a potentially bad decision. Where are you flying at in Denver? I used to fly out of BJC (Journeys).

[northofnowhere]

I've just made the same decision as well. With school, my income and age (18) right now and forcing myself to put my life on hold, it just wasn't worth it. If logic or a gut feeling makes your decision, chances are you're making the right decision. Best of luck to you.

[aloft]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

There are ways to build some quality multi out there, too. Stay tuned....

Uh huh, and..... I'm still listening! With bated breath, even!