And So it Begins...Mesa Dash Flying Terminated

[kellwolf]

Originally Posted by Trip7

All thats going on here is the shifting of flying from arguably the worst paying airline in the industry to possibly one of the best. And possibly one of the more respected regional airlines loaning money to a mainline to help them stay in business so there are mainline jobs to go to in todays credit crunch.

That's some seriously management worthy spin, Marcus. I think you're on the wrong side. We don't even know where THIS flying is going, if anywhere. The flying ASA is starting is likely different flying altogether. If not, I really don't see how this is helping to generate mainline jobs. Isn't United still furloughing more guys while growing their regional feed? Seems to me they're outsourcing to save money in order to stay solvent. Now, if Skywest loaned them money to keep some 737s flying, I might agree with you, but until all the furloughs are back and United is hiring again, it's still growing their regional feed at the expense of mainline jobs. Honestly, United could still stay around. All they have to do is outsource till they have no more planes or pilots left themselves. The company would still be solvent and in existence, but there would be no mainline jobs. Technically, Midwest is still around, but I don't think any cash influx from Republic is gonna help generate more mainline jobs.

[jynxyjoe]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

That's some seriously management worthy spin, Marcus.

Eh, you can't blame him. He's got a 4 year degree in business

I do agree with you, United is not doing anything to preserve mainline jobs. I thought United was employee owned. Is that just a cliche?

[aevfo]

Originally Posted by Trip7

Your complete response show you know nothing about business. Talk to me after you get some kind of education.

As an ASA pilot who is very happy to be placing those 14 A/C, you need to give it a rest. Your aviation management degree from podunk Oklahoma with your summa cum laude is nothing to be bragging about. You are starting to sound more and more like a management tool when you start spewing the company koolaid.

1. Be happy you have a job. As the plug on the list you are pretty lucky to still be employed. You were one class from being furloughed

2. Be happy you work at a halfway decent place. No regional is a good place.

3. Don't post every rumor you hear or read about as a fact. Makes you look retarded

4. Please give it a rest with the koolaid. This includes IAD, ORD, and issues such as PBS.

[smokey1]

Why do people even bother to listen to this guy?(trip 7) 100% koolaid drinker. Newbie.

[Trip7]

Originally Posted by aevfo

As an ASA pilot who is very happy to be placing those 14 A/C, you need to give it a rest. Your aviation management degree from podunk Oklahoma with your summa cum laude is nothing to be bragging about. You are starting to sound more and more like a management tool when you start spewing the company koolaid.

1. Be happy you have a job. As the plug on the list you are pretty lucky to still be employed. You were one class from being furloughed

2. Be happy you work at a halfway decent place. No regional is a good place.

3. Don't post every rumor you hear or read about as a fact. Makes you look retarded

4. Please give it a rest with the koolaid. This includes IAD, ORD, and issues such as PBS.

Everything I say is purely my opinion based on what I see. The fact that many take what I'm saying as "fact" is hilarious.

Next, I state my opinions without ever insulting anyone and some people decide to just unleash personal attacks if they don't like what I have to say. Hope it makes em feel better because I'll never stop stating my opinions.

Originally Posted by smokey1

Why do people even bother to listen to this guy?(trip 7) 100% koolaid drinker. Newbie.

Ignore button man...

[Trip7]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

That's some seriously management worthy spin, Marcus. I think you're on the wrong side. We don't even know where THIS flying is going, if anywhere. The flying ASA is starting is likely different flying altogether. If not, I really don't see how this is helping to generate mainline jobs. Isn't United still furloughing more guys while growing their regional feed? Seems to me they're outsourcing to save money in order to stay solvent. Now, if Skywest loaned them money to keep some 737s flying, I might agree with you, but until all the furloughs are back and United is hiring again, it's still growing their regional feed at the expense of mainline jobs. Honestly, United could still stay around. All they have to do is outsource till they have no more planes or pilots left themselves. The company would still be solvent and in existence, but there would be no mainline jobs. Technically, Midwest is still around, but I don't think any cash influx from Republic is gonna help generate more mainline jobs.

You might be right about United downsizing mainline and growing the regional feed but it remains to be known until we see if the United RFP was for replacement of the Mesa flying or new flying all together. Seems to me this is just replacement flying and shifting around of the UAX regional flying between carriers. That is all.

The whole other regional outsourcing means less mainline jobs for all is a known fact around the industry has been repeated almost on a daily basis. Not getting in an 10 page discussion on that dead horse again.

[Bumblebee]

Originally Posted by Lee D

This rumor has been going the rounds for awhile. (Q400's) I initially also heard the EMB + 5%, but last I heard was it would pay CRJ 50 rates now. (The former would be unacceptable. )

So would the 50 seat CRJ rate, these are 73 seat aircraft! I can say that when we discuss "possibilities" we are determined to negotiate from the 70 seat rate first. Less is not a reasonable amount. I know we are not a union, but we (SAPA) deliver the pay package to the pilots for a vote.

(That's the way it has worked historically)

[aevfo]

Originally Posted by Trip7

Everything I say is purely my opinion based on what I see. The fact that many take what I'm saying as "fact" is hilarious.

Next, I state my opinions without ever insulting anyone and some people decide to just unleash personal attacks if they don't like what I have to say. Hope it makes em feel better because I'll never stop stating my opinions.

Originally Posted by Trip7

And possibly one of the more respected regional airlines loaning money to a mainline to help them stay in business so there are mainline jobs to go to in todays credit crunch.

The only way a rational person could reach this opinion is after gallons of koolaid and lots of smoking grass. UAL needs cash and SKYW is in the position to loan money. It is a good business move by SKYW. This has nothing to do with mainline jobs (besides maybe a tilton bonus).

Originally Posted by Trip7

Your complete response show you know nothing about business. Talk to me after you get some kind of education.

Sounds like an insult to me. The fact that you believe your aviation degree with business minor makes you qualified to talk business is laughable at best.

[bike21]

Originally Posted by Bumblebee

So would the 50 seat CRJ rate, these are 73 seat aircraft! I can say that when we discuss "possibilities" we are determined to negotiate from the 70 seat rate first. Less is not a reasonable amount. I know we are not a union, but we (SAPA) deliver the pay package to the pilots for a vote.

(That's the way it has worked historically)

With all due respect, you know those votes don't matter one way or another. Sad fact, our management (and pilot group for that matter) has proven that time & time again.

[bike21]

Originally Posted by mrivc211

Oh and if you're wondering, yes, our FO's will scab out and fly the Q-400 at Brasilia rates +5%. It's already been discussed on our forums. As much as they deny in public, when time comes, these little kids will drool at the chance.

Plenty of captains that would do the same as well. We have a systemic problem that needs fixin' stat.

[JaceTheAce]

Originally Posted by H46Bubba

Not yet. They're still flying some Dash-8's for Airways out of PHX.

Piedmont?

[SpiraMirabilis]

Assuming this doesn't cause Mesa to go into BK, and thats a pretty big assumption, I wouldn't be surprised if they moved 4 or 5 of those Dashes out to Hawaii.

[CrippleHawk]

Originally Posted by jynxyjoe

United is not doing anything to preserve mainline jobs. I thought United was employee owned. Is that just a cliche?

Now why am I not surprised?

[SpiraMirabilis]

United used to be employee owned, not after the last BK though.

[CamYZ125]

Originally Posted by JaceTheAce

Piedmont?

It's funny, I had a PHX Captain tell me last night that he heard a rumor floating around corporate that Mesa was placing these DHC8's in CLT after the UAL termination. Ha, right. I'll believe that when I see it..

More likely, I think if they can't place them or get rid of them, putting them in Hawaii would be the next smartest move.

[A-300F4-622R]

Originally Posted by aevfo

The only way a rational person could reach this opinion is after gallons of koolaid and lots of smoking grass. UAL needs cash and SKYW is in the position to loan money. It is a good business move by SKYW. This has nothing to do with mainline jobs (besides maybe a tilton bonus).



Sounds like an insult to me. The fact that you believe your aviation degree with business minor makes you qualified to talk business is laughable at best.

Everyone's entitled to their opinion. Certain opinions carry more weight than others and some people just don't know what they don't know.

[H46Bubba]

Originally Posted by CamYZ125

It's funny, I had a PHX Captain tell me last night that he heard a rumor floating around corporate that Mesa was placing these DHC8's in CLT after the UAL termination. Ha, right. I'll believe that when I see it..

More likely, I think if they can't place them or get rid of them, putting them in Hawaii would be the next smartest move.

JO also has the option to offer to fly those for Airways as "at risk" flying like Colgan does with it's Saabs. The only options are to do that or move them to Hawaii and operate them for go! It'll cost them a buch of money for repaint and interior mods, so I don't see them going that route. When we planned the initial go! interior mods and painting for the ex-IndyAir RJ's; it was pretty expensive, but that was when MAG had plenty of cash on hand. There's no mainline customer to pass on the expenses to with go!. It's now Novemeber 1st, unless UA has optioned to renew the 26 CRJ's, JO also has to find a place for those too. There's just no market in Hawaii to support a buch or RJ's. It would dilute the current market share of passengers and go! would be operating at less than half capacity at an increased operating cost with the current revenue stream.

[Socal321]

Originally Posted by aevfo

Your aviation management degree from podunk Oklahoma with your summa cum laude is nothing to be bragging about.

.

Hahaha, yea.. and if he was one class from being furloughed it would mean he's pretty low on the list. Makes his managment spew sound more ridiculous.

[wheelsup]

FWIW everyone I worked with when making web sites who owned and ran a company didn't have any sort of a business degree. Most were engineers. Some were accountants. Two were doctors. A few had no degrees.

Business is one of those things in life that some people just know. It's like the whole total time/experience vs. highly trained yet low time pilot in the cockpit argument. A business degree might give you rote knowledge but it's useless without any sort of real experience.

[A-300F4-622R]

Originally Posted by wheelsup

FWIW everyone I worked with when making web sites who owned and ran a company didn't have any sort of a business degree. Most were engineers. Some were accountants. Two were doctors. A few had no degrees.

Business is one of those things in life that some people just know. It's like the whole total time/experience vs. highly trained yet low time pilot in the cockpit argument. A business degree might give you rote knowledge but it's useless without any sort of real experience.

Just like an aviation degree.

[mrivc211]

Originally Posted by bike21

Plenty of captains that would do the same as well. We have a systemic problem that needs fixin' stat.

sad but true. I'll be at the bar stealing all the women while ya'll keep fighting.

[Socal321]

Originally Posted by A-300F4-622R

Just like an aviation degree.

No that's useless period. Unless a business accepts any degree.

[Socal321]

Originally Posted by Trip7

Everything I say is purely my opinion based on what I see. The fact that many take what I'm saying as "fact" is hilarious.

Next, I state my opinions without ever insulting anyone and some people decide to just unleash personal attacks if they don't like what I have to say. Hope it makes em feel better because I'll never stop stating my opinions.

Well at least you admit you have no idea what you're talking about. Thanks. You should put up that disclaimer every time you post about airline issues because you really need it.

[jynxyjoe]

Jesus guys. Take it easy.

[Table Two]

So, I hear Mesa lost their Dash flying?