XJT Branded Flying

[Velocipede]

Mike Boyd's take:

Actually, A Fleet of Edsels May Have More Value. ExpressJet, the supplier of ERJ lift to Continental, lost a game of price-chicken with its customer Continental and came out of the meeting with 69 ERJ-145s all dressed up and no longer needed by CO. Trying to place excess RJs at other airline systems is like trying to sell last week's lottery tickets. So, they started an independent carrier called, innovatively, ExpressJet, flying point-to-point routes where, at least when they started, there was no nonstop service.

Worked so well that they petitioned the DOT to not publish ExpressJet traffic data. No wonder. When the data was finally made available, the load factors in most markets approximated the temperature on a warm winter day in Anchorage. The combination of a no-identity brand, and the thrill of sitting on an RJ for in some cases long periods, more than offset what appears to be an operationally first class airline. The most recent financials show a $76 million loss for the branded all-ERJ operation.

[PGT]

pretty big loss.

how is marketing at XJ? I think marketing should be a big part of every airline

[777forever]

Originally Posted by PGT

pretty big loss.

how is marketing at XJ? I think marketing should be a big part of every airline

Yeah but I think it will take a long time to build the kind of name recognition the Majors and LCCs have, especially with 50 RJs.

Well, Velo, this was the opinion I was trying to share in a another thread when I was shot down for not knowing anything

[CamYZ125]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

The most recent financials show a $76 million loss for the branded all-ERJ operation.

Might as well have wrongfully used information to start up a competitor airline in Hawaii. Ha..

[Hootie]

Originally Posted by PGT

how is marketing at XJ?

I've never seen or heard a Mesaba commercial.

[777forever]

Originally Posted by Hootie

I've never seen or heard a Mesaba commercial.

[BobDDuck]

blah blah blah start up costs blah blah blah market leveling blah blah blah give it time blah blah blah

I'm sure the Xjet cheerleading squad will be around in a few minutes.

Don't get me wrong, I wish them all the luck, but despite the fact they aren't going head to head with UAL out of IAD, the plan is remarkably like FlyI's.

[ljg]

Interesting how many people will criticize individual pilot scumbags who will work for lower wages and non-union shops, but then criticize a company that wouldn't lower its set pricing structure to bow down and keep the business of the Almighty Cal.

[Doug Taylor]

I think I missed this part:

but then criticize a company that wouldn't lower its set pricing structure to bow down and keep the business of the Almighty Cal.

[Alchemy]

Boyd seems to know it all regarding the circumstances of CAL's regional diversification, but I seriously doubt he's any more informed about the situation than any of us here (which is to say, not very). Aside from that, all we have are more obvious proclamations from him from about RJ CASM. Not saying I disagree per se, just that it's mostly obvious.

With that said Xjet isn't going anywhere for awhile. That 76 million dollar loss is offset by the guaranteed $40,000,000/yr profit of COEX, and that deal is in place for at least another 12 months. With a quarter billion cash on hand, that can be sustatined for quite awhile. Give xjet another year for market saturation and maybe they can come close to breaking even. After that, who knows? The next year is certainly going to intersting, but I certainly don't see CH 11 around the corner...yet.

Even so, those of you who've heard me before know that I'm keeping the resume and have contingency plans in place, as would be prudent for any pilot at any airline. Hope for the best but prepare for the worst....

[jtrain609]

Can't place 50 seaters? News to me. We continue to transfer a few EMB-145XR's to Delta every couple of months. Delta has told us they'll take every single airplane we can give them at this point.

[wheelsup]

Why don't they just raise ticket prices? That would solve everything, might even be able to get pay raises then too!!! Jeez!

[777forever]

Originally Posted by jtrain609

Can't place 50 seaters? News to me. We continue to transfer a few EMB-145XR's to Delta every couple of months. Delta has told us they'll take every single airplane we can give them at this point.

Will they take all 69? Over here they are cutting back unprofitable flights due to high fuel cost. I think we're losing a couple cities.

[meritflyer]

It's no secret that ASA has done a poor job for Delta. When the deal was executed with XJT out of LAX, Delta shared concerns with XJT management about ASA's issues out of LAX as well as ATL in hopes XJT could "cure" the ailment.

During a recent meeting with Delta's CEO and XJT's VP of Airport Services, Anderson did in fact say XJT set the standard that all DCI carriers would be measured by and that Delta was ready to take their west coast relationship with XJT to "the next level", whatever that means. This information was well shared by XJT's management with employees.

Delta's original deal with XJT was for 10 jets which started in May '07. Delta has continued to add over 10 more aircraft bringing the count to 21 over the last five months. Even as recent as CAL just released the last 3 aircraft from the original 69, Delta had it's hand out and will place them into service out of Salt Lake City come January '08.

[Velocipede]

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

Don't get me wrong, I wish them all the luck, but despite the fact they aren't going head to head with UAL out of IAD, the plan is remarkably like FlyI's.

You said a mouthful there, Bob. It should prove just as successful. All I can tell you from personal observation, the passenger loads out of my city are pathetic.

[meritflyer]

Velo, which city do you live in?

[Alchemy]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

You said a mouthful there, Bob. It should prove just as successful. All I can tell you from personal observation, the passenger loads out of my city are pathetic.

Don't worry velo, alaska air group doesn't have anything to worry about. Oh wait you did drop BOI-SAN....guess you couldn't compete with us on that market

The bottom line is people in the airline biz really like to pile on when they smell blood in the water.

Back in 2003-2004, I think a lot of people were secretly hoping that USAirways and or United would liquidate so that it would make the going easier for everyone else. When it's an RJ operator that's in trouble, it really makes people salivate.

[SmitteyB]

Why are you XJET guys getting so defensive?

It's a failing operation, pretty simple. It's nothing against you guys- most of you are class acts. I wish the best of luck to everyone there.

There are many people who chose not to go there because of the unstability that we saw over a year and a half ago. That aside...what is the upgrade there now?

[Chris_Ford]

Originally Posted by SmitteyB

Why are you XJET guys getting so defensive?

It's a failing operation, pretty simple. It's nothing against you guys- most of you are class acts. I wish the best of luck to everyone there.

There are many people who chose not to go there because of the unstability that we saw over a year and a half ago. That aside...what is the upgrade there now?

Jeez guys, this thing has been around for what, 6 months? Southwest didn't turn a profit in its first six months either....

Originally Posted by wiki

Early losses and financial troubles

The rest of 1971 and 1972 saw operating losses. One of the four aircraft was sold to Frontier Airlines and the proceeds used to make payroll and cover other expenses. Southwest continued to operate a schedule predicated on four aircraft but using only three, and in so doing the "ten minute turn" was born, and was the standard ground time for many years.[9]
Southwest turned its first annual profit in 1973, and has done so every year since

[meritflyer]

Originally Posted by SmitteyB

Why are you XJET guys getting so defensive?

I didn't see anyone getting defensive. However, it does get annoying reading uneducated threads like these.

It's a failing operation, pretty simple. It's nothing against you guys- most of you are class acts. I wish the best of luck to everyone there.

Hard to classify it as a "failing operation" when branded is in it's infancy, Delta taking more jets monthly, and loads/yields steadily increasing.

There are many people who chose not to go there because of the unstability that we saw over a year and a half ago. That aside...what is the upgrade there now?

Welcome to the airline industry! Guys hired 2.5 years ago are still upgrading.

unstability

Isn't even a word but I am sure you already knew that. Try instability.

[Alchemy]

Originally Posted by SmitteyB

Why are you XJET guys getting so defensive?

It's a failing operation, pretty simple. It's nothing against you guys- most of you are class acts. I wish the best of luck to everyone there.

There are many people who chose not to go there because of the unstability that we saw over a year and a half ago. That aside...what is the upgrade there now?

BACK OFF!!!! I'M NOT GETTING DEFENSIVE!!!!

I'll be the first to tell you that I thought this business plan was a bad idea. But now that we're going with it I'm going to support it and do whatever I can to make it succeed. Unfortunately, there's not a whole lot I can do in the grand scheme of things. Like I said, keep the resume fresh and keep your CFI current....

[meritflyer]

Originally Posted by Alchemy

I'll be the first to tell you that I thought this business plan was a bad idea.

It was risky but it was the only viable option that met the limitations placed on XJT by CAL and the current contract. It left XJT literally, no options other than a branded service and a west coast operation (Delta).

[FlyChicaga]

We have terrible (also known as non-existent) marketing. It needs an overhaul.

With oil and jet fuel prices, we will have trouble making money. So will every other airline out there, until ticket prices are raised. We are not a low-cost carrier, however. Our ticket prices for some routes in the holiday season are high.

We have a great product, and our passengers comment on this every flight. I don't know how many times I have heard the comment, "This is the best airline I have ever flown on!" Even business passengers are impressed. That says a lot, considering we have been doing more with less, and had many growing pains along the way. We want this to work, and it shows.

If we can market our product properly, and get a break in fuel costs, we have a fighting chance. If we don't make some great strides, we will suffer.

Branded isn't "failing." It is suffering, however. Just like many other airlines right now... We are all in for a long road ahead if management doesn't compensate for the additional fuel costs with increased ticket prices.

[SmitteyB]

Originally Posted by meritflyer

I didn't see anyone getting defensive. However, it does get annoying reading uneducated threads like these.

You must not be reading this thread.

Originally Posted by Alchemy

Don't worry velo, alaska air group doesn't have anything to worry about. Oh wait you did drop BOI-SAN....guess you couldn't compete with us on that market.

That seems quite defensive to me.

Originally Posted by meritflyer

Hard to classify it as a "failing operation" when branded is in it's infancy, Delta taking more jets monthly, and loads/yields steadily increasing.

I didn't mean XJT as a whole is failing- just talking about branded.

Originally Posted by meritflyer

Welcome to the airline industry! Guys hired 2.5 years ago are still upgrading.

Okay- it was an innocent question.

Isn't even a word but I am sure you already knew that. Try instability.

Actually it was a typo. My apologies.

[WAFlyBoy]

Originally Posted by FlyChicaga

We have terrible (also known as non-existent) marketing. It needs an overhaul.

And free booze. Offering business travelers a free pint of Wild Turkey may have kept Southwest solvent in its infancy.