TSA Ramp Decoys

[N422NM]

From company today, one more thing to deal with. I think I'm gonna write my senator a long letter....



TSA Inspectors are acting as decoys by not displaying their SIDA badges. They are doing this to catch employees who do not challenge them, for no badge in a secured area.
Please be vigilant, and CHALLENGE ANYONE WHO DOES NOT DISPLAY A SIDA BADGE.
Also, do not piggyback through secured areas.

[Captain_Bob]

That kind of thing has been going on for a while now...

I saw a ramper get written up because he didn't challenge an FAA guy on the ramp... but he was hooked up to us on tug and headset. I noticed a guy standing about 20 feet behind him just looking at him. The ramper couldn't see the guy since he was facing us on the tug. I say to the captain... "Who's that guy over there?" The CA looks up and says... "I don't know..." By this time the ramper had gotten of the tug and walked over to unhook the GPS and then return to the tug while still hooked up on headset.

The guy behind him immediately walked up behind him and got his attention... the rampers mic was hot and we heard the whole thing about how he was with the FAA and to not go anywhere after this pushback because he'll need to speak to him and his supervisor since he didn't challenge him.

The Captain was pissed... he got on OPS freq. and told the ramper's side of the story to our OPS folks... that the FAA guy was behind the ramper... and the only time the ramper could have seen him was when he got off the tug to unhook the GPS and yet was still hooked up to our aircraft and essentially in control of our aircraft just prior to push.

It would be different if the FAA guy just casually walked by him while the ramper was on his way to another gate... but in this case... it was a bit over the top.

Regardless... we let ops know that we had noticed the guy and that we were about to question him but he came up behind the ramper before we could do anything.

The CA really went to bat for this guy... we delayed our push 5 minutes while the captain spoke with the guys supervisor on the headsets with the FAA guy still standing there. He gave him his name, EE# and Cell# and said that he'd support the ramper 100% and that the FAA guy was wrong in doing what he was trying to do while the ramper was in the middle of performing an essential safety function...

After the pushback checklist and just prior to the Taxi check... the Captain turns to me and say... "God I hate the FAA!"

Anyway... that was last year.

The FAA... they're here to help...

Bob

[Kingairer]

These idiots are just bored, idle hands...

[dc3flyer]

TSA/FAA Slogan:



We're not happy until you're not happy!

[EDUC8-or]

They've been watching us in BHM (I think) with binnoculars to make sure we open all of the panels on the first flight of the day checks. Also, I was in PNS and a TSA agent accompanied me during my walkaround. They didn't say much because I don't really think they knew what I was looking for.

[BobDDuck]

I got in trouble (sort of) in BHM because of that. I was doing a walk around and had walked about 50 feet behind the airplane to look at the tail. I thought we were missing a static wick but with the sunlight it was hard to tell. Anyhow, this guy walks up to me (with no ID on) and asks to see me SIDA badge. Of course I don't have one for BHM but I show him my crew badge. He says that that is not sufficient and I am on the ramp with out authorization. I point out that I am actually doing a walk around on the airplane that is 50 feet away. He tells me that my ID is only good for the "footprint" of the airplane, which I knew but assumed that 50 feet is still in the footprint. He tells me he will have to escort me out of the secure area and then have me verified by a operations agent. He starts to walk across the ramp but of course I don't follow him. He stops and comes back and asks if I am going to go with him. At that point I asked to see his ID and he shows me an ID that says "TSA Security Inspector". I tell him that is all well and good but where is his SIDA badge. Oh he says, I don't need one. At that point I tell him that I have no way of knowing that he is authorized to detain me, let alone be on the ramp. He was carrying a radio and I told him that neither one of us was going anywhere until somebody with a TSA or FAA ID and SIDA badge came out. He started to walk away but I started to follow him so he pulled out his radio and made a call and after about 5 minutes a guy in a suit jacket and 2 police officers came out. He said to the guy in the suit that I had been wandering on the ramp and then I told the guy that I was about 50 feet from my airplane and that this guy had no ID on him. The guy in the suit said it was no problem and told me to go back to my airplane and to have a nice day.

I wrote up a whole ops report and our security department looked into it. About 2 months later I got an apology letter from the TSA stating that the agent had overstepped his bounds and was not authorized to be doing ramp checks.

I know... I should never loose the letter because I'll never hear a government agency say "we messed up" ever again.

Moral of the story... they are out there.


EDIT: Jeremy, you beat me to the BHM thing.

[kellwolf]

The TSA has degrading (or I guess maybe just turned into since it really wasn't that hot to begin with) into an organization of people that just want to throw their weight around. They're basically all "look at me" high school bullies that do what they want b/c the government backs them.

[N422NM]

I was told by an FAA inspector at a conference that the TSA people can excercise authority over them as well. It's an agency that has no real oversight and hides itself behind the "need for security..."

The question is, when is this gonna finally go to far and/or be brought back in check ?

[crashmbern]

We had a few TSA inspectors come on board about 2 weeks ago to do some random inspection that I guess they are allowed to do. Cabin service had already been complete, and it took 4 TSA inspectors to look at just the overhead bins of a 64 seat airplane.

Anybody know how much a new TSA employee makes in a year?? I am pretty sure they make more than I do.

adam

[EDUC8-or]

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

I got in trouble (sort of) in BHM because of that. I was doing a walk around and had walked about 50 feet behind the airplane to look at the tail. I thought we were missing a static wick but with the sunlight it was hard to tell. Anyhow, this guy walks up to me (with no ID on) and asks to see me SIDA badge. Of course I don't have one for BHM but I show him my crew badge. He says that that is not sufficient and I am on the ramp with out authorization. I point out that I am actually doing a walk around on the airplane that is 50 feet away. He tells me that my ID is only good for the "footprint" of the airplane, which I knew but assumed that 50 feet is still in the footprint. He tells me he will have to escort me out of the secure area and then have me verified by a operations agent. He starts to walk across the ramp but of course I don't follow him. He stops and comes back and asks if I am going to go with him. At that point I asked to see his ID and he shows me an ID that says "TSA Security Inspector". I tell him that is all well and good but where is his SIDA badge. Oh he says, I don't need one. At that point I tell him that I have no way of knowing that he is authorized to detain me, let alone be on the ramp. He was carrying a radio and I told him that neither one of us was going anywhere until somebody with a TSA or FAA ID and SIDA badge came out. He started to walk away but I started to follow him so he pulled out his radio and made a call and after about 5 minutes a guy in a suit jacket and 2 police officers came out. He said to the guy in the suit that I had been wandering on the ramp and then I told the guy that I was about 50 feet from my airplane and that this guy had no ID on him. The guy in the suit said it was no problem and told me to go back to my airplane and to have a nice day.

I wrote up a whole ops report and our security department looked into it. About 2 months later I got an apology letter from the TSA stating that the agent had overstepped his bounds and was not authorized to be doing ramp checks.

I know... I should never loose the letter because I'll never hear a government agency say "we messed up" ever again.

Moral of the story... they are out there.


EDIT: Jeremy, you beat me to the BHM thing.

Howdy Doody in full effect!

[wheelsup]

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

At that point I asked to see his ID and he shows me an ID that says "TSA Security Inspector". I tell him that is all well and good but where is his SIDA badge. Oh he says, I don't need one. At that point I tell him that I have no way of knowing that he is authorized to detain me, let alone be on the ramp.

classic

[Champcar]

Originally Posted by N422NM

From company today, one more thing to deal with. I think I'm gonna write my senator a long letter....



TSA Inspectors are acting as decoys by not displaying their SIDA badges. They are doing this to catch employees who do not challenge them, for no badge in a secured area.
Please be vigilant, and CHALLENGE ANYONE WHO DOES NOT DISPLAY A SIDA BADGE.
Also, do not piggyback through secured areas.

You sure they are not watching out for illegals?

[Doug Taylor]

The TSA is bored and trying to look like it has a much wider function.

It's the standard, "Hey! Look at my hand...look at my hand...." while the other hand is pilfering in your personal belongings.

So now they're picking on crewmembers, changed security directives, what six times in a single day (all official), and then another three times that same week with increasingly vague rules you were responsible to follow or risk violation...

Mike Boyd Speaketh the Truth

[mccube5]

Someone needs to bring these guys back to reality. Crazy the power given to these guys post 9-11 without and real thought.

[sky7]

Instead of looking for the bad guys, they are looking to make the good guys look bad. I was talking to a two-stripe tsa and asked him what the second stripe was. He said it was just double the paycheck. nice

[Cruise]

Originally Posted by dc3flyer

TSA/FAA Slogan:



We're not happy until you're not happy!

I LOVE IT! LMAO

[EDUC8-or]

So I'm in TLH the other day in my uniform going through security and the TSA agent pulls my lunch bag out of the same bin that has my uniform coat and holds it up.

"I need to speak to the owner of this bag."

"That would be me, ma'am."

"This is a toiletry bag, there are toiletries in here, you can't have those."

"Actually, I'm in my uniform so I can and those aren't toiletries, that's granola bars, oatmeal, and pudding."

"I know, you can't have that."

"You know what? What can't I have? You just said those are toiletries."

"Yes, I know. You can't have those."

"Uhh, who's on first?"

Finally the supervisor came over laughing at my comment along with an apology. Can't a man just eat his pudding in peace?

[BobDDuck]

But son... that pudding could be explosive and used to gain access to the flight deck.

Honestly, you want to know the most dangerous thing onboard the airplane?

The forward lav that overflowed all the way back to row 10 and which the company let dry, then vacuumed up anything left and then returned to service. Maybe the TSA should be looking for that.

[bwade210]

They are out in drones here in KSAT. From what I have heard, they have "busted" a number of ramp agents with other carriers.

[SteveC]

Originally Posted by bwade210

They are out in drones here in KSAT.

Word for the day tip:

"Droves" versus "drones"

[MQAAord]

OMG reading this just makes me weep for our industry.

Seriously, I actually have tears in my eyes thinking about what this job used to be, and what it's become.

[Doug Taylor]

Back in the 727 days, there was a inspector that was notorious for coming up the aft airstairs during passenger boarding, going into the lavatory and waiting until boarding was almost done to flash his badge, shut the operation down and counsel the crew on security and inquire why no one noticed an extra passenger.

[N422NM]

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

Back in the 727 days, there was a inspector that was notorious for coming up the aft airstairs during passenger boarding, going into the lavatory and waiting until boarding was almost done to flash his badge, shut the operation down and counsel the crew on security and inquire why no one noticed an extra passenger.

Tell him you think of D.B. Cooper as a hero ?

For what it's worth, I fired off a letter to my senate and congressional delegation voicing my concerns about 'TSA gone wild.'

[kellwolf]

Originally Posted by EDUC8-or

"I need to speak to the owner of this bag."

"That would be me, ma'am."

"This is a toiletry bag, there are toiletries in here, you can't have those."

Dear god. What's next? TSA raiding my frig at home?

TSA: "Ah ha! This is an illegal use of a toiletries bag! We'll have to take this."
Me: "WTF? It's a gallon size ziploc bag with three pieces of salmon in it!"
TSA: "No, this is a toiletries bag. We're from the government, we know."
Me: "Fine. Whatever. You guys are morons."
TSA: "What did you call us? Give us your license. We think you're a threat. If you want to appeal you can contact....uh....us."

[Maurus]

Seems like TSA worries more about company employees than passengers. My father just flew back home and he had his swiss army knife in his carry on. He forgot about the knife. It is just sad that he was able to do that.