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Denny · January 8th, 2008, 00:14

Wow! Haven't been here in months and months and this thread is still at the top. Good responses. But some are missing the point. The point isn't about the people (although they are an ancillary consideration.) The point is about the rules and your FOM and the FARs. This thread is about a lav but it could be about anything else on the plane.

I've flown civilian and corporate. This wouldn't be an issue. But in the airline world it is an issue because there are so many procedures and followups.

Something is broken. In the airline world you don't generally want to operate with something broken. If you do you are responsible because somewhere down the line someone WILL find out about it and it will come back to you. If the company gets involved it is back for special training. If the FAA gets involved it is an investigatory matter. One of the two will ALWAYS happen. Always. So pilots at an airline generally will not put their livelihood on the line for connecting pax or other such considerations.

Circuit breakers. With the current state of modern planes the electronics business is not what you are in. CBs today are not like they were in the old days. Don't touch them unless specifically directed to do so. You may fix something temporarily but the problems you cause by doing that may very well multiply and as noted above it will get back to you. Why'd you do that? We don't train you to do that.

Lastly if you do call someone about the issue, ops, mx, the station, etc. then there is a written record of that discrepancy. And the FARs do not allow you to have the discretion to just go. Once it is reported it must be addressed. You have no decision to make other than to wait for mx. Hence that 757 driver waiting to have one lav out of 7 looked at. You do NOT have the authority to just say forget it and go.

We are talking about the airline world here not our own private or corporate planes. Someone is always looking over your shoulder. And if you ignore something any number of people from your F/O to your F/As to any knowledgeable pax can and will report it. You just don't need that kind of problem to deal with. The integrity of the plane, however inconsequential it may seem, always trumps the pax schedule. The planes have got to work if this industry is going to work. Today it is a lav. Tomorrow it is something else. Everyday will be something. The decisions are always easy and simple. They are there for you in the FOM, the Airplane Operating Manual and the MEL. They tell you what to do. You don't have much say in the matter at the end of the day if you do your job and want to keep it.

January 8th, 2008, 00:14	#69
Denny Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 8	Re: Inoperable Lavatory Wow! Haven't been here in months and months and this thread is still at the top. Good responses. But some are missing the point. The point isn't about the people (although they are an ancillary consideration.) The point is about the rules and your FOM and the FARs. This thread is about a lav but it could be about anything else on the plane. I've flown civilian and corporate. This wouldn't be an issue. But in the airline world it is an issue because there are so many procedures and followups. Something is broken. In the airline world you don't generally want to operate with something broken. If you do you are responsible because somewhere down the line someone WILL find out about it and it will come back to you. If the company gets involved it is back for special training. If the FAA gets involved it is an investigatory matter. One of the two will ALWAYS happen. Always. So pilots at an airline generally will not put their livelihood on the line for connecting pax or other such considerations. Circuit breakers. With the current state of modern planes the electronics business is not what you are in. CBs today are not like they were in the old days. Don't touch them unless specifically directed to do so. You may fix something temporarily but the problems you cause by doing that may very well multiply and as noted above it will get back to you. Why'd you do that? We don't train you to do that. Lastly if you do call someone about the issue, ops, mx, the station, etc. then there is a written record of that discrepancy. And the FARs do not allow you to have the discretion to just go. Once it is reported it must be addressed. You have no decision to make other than to wait for mx. Hence that 757 driver waiting to have one lav out of 7 looked at. You do NOT have the authority to just say forget it and go. We are talking about the airline world here not our own private or corporate planes. Someone is always looking over your shoulder. And if you ignore something any number of people from your F/O to your F/As to any knowledgeable pax can and will report it. You just don't need that kind of problem to deal with. The integrity of the plane, however inconsequential it may seem, always trumps the pax schedule. The planes have got to work if this industry is going to work. Today it is a lav. Tomorrow it is something else. Everyday will be something. The decisions are always easy and simple. They are there for you in the FOM, the Airplane Operating Manual and the MEL. They tell you what to do. You don't have much say in the matter at the end of the day if you do your job and want to keep it.